From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B0D9B13832E for ; Thu, 18 Aug 2016 06:06:41 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id F1EA721C043; Thu, 18 Aug 2016 06:06:11 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp.gentoo.org (smtp.gentoo.org [140.211.166.183]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 865A821C012 for ; Thu, 18 Aug 2016 06:06:05 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [192.168.1.2] (c-73-53-75-119.hsd1.wa.comcast.net [73.53.75.119]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: zlg) by smtp.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4B5E1340D09 for ; Thu, 18 Aug 2016 06:06:04 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] libpcre.so.3 - Compatibility with Debian To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org References: <20160811001053.5b98e44a@symphony.aura-online.co.uk> <22444.18637.297626.134016@a1i15.kph.uni-mainz.de> <20160811111141.16bdfcd5@red.yakaraplc.local> <22444.22978.952581.582549@a1i15.kph.uni-mainz.de> <1470927479.5563.16.camel@gentoo.org> <4b09dfc4-b6ca-fb1b-adc3-e9c9da766a10@gentoo.org> <20160811205620.6b782217@symphony.aura-online.co.uk> <20160812093435.59ad476b@katipo2.lan> <1470964747.5563.43.camel@gentoo.org> From: Daniel Campbell Message-ID: Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2016 23:06:02 -0700 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.2.0 Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <1470964747.5563.43.camel@gentoo.org> Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="jUMKlFBRTENC8cBx1uGkFWo8fWS9NT2sO" X-Archives-Salt: 04c9c9f6-a3d4-4771-82f9-f37a0fc0fafa X-Archives-Hash: 07a39fe938c0ac5f3f1e3c75e3ca5c70 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --jUMKlFBRTENC8cBx1uGkFWo8fWS9NT2sO Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="0sPhvJqBg48DIo2UhVXefR7vCaDDgVcg1" From: Daniel Campbell To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Message-ID: Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] libpcre.so.3 - Compatibility with Debian References: <20160811001053.5b98e44a@symphony.aura-online.co.uk> <22444.18637.297626.134016@a1i15.kph.uni-mainz.de> <20160811111141.16bdfcd5@red.yakaraplc.local> <22444.22978.952581.582549@a1i15.kph.uni-mainz.de> <1470927479.5563.16.camel@gentoo.org> <4b09dfc4-b6ca-fb1b-adc3-e9c9da766a10@gentoo.org> <20160811205620.6b782217@symphony.aura-online.co.uk> <20160812093435.59ad476b@katipo2.lan> <1470964747.5563.43.camel@gentoo.org> In-Reply-To: <1470964747.5563.43.camel@gentoo.org> --0sPhvJqBg48DIo2UhVXefR7vCaDDgVcg1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 08/11/2016 06:19 PM, Mart Raudsepp wrote: > =C3=9Chel kenal p=C3=A4eval, N, 11.08.2016 kell 18:00, kirjutas Mike Gi= lbert: >> On Thu, Aug 11, 2016 at 5:34 PM, Kent Fredric >> wrote: >>> On Thu, 11 Aug 2016 16:07:27 -0400 >>> Ian Stakenvicius wrote: >>> >>>> but realistically this should be >>>> installed to /usr/$(get_libdir)/debiancompat/ or similar, and if >>>> you >>>> still don't want to wrap the apps that need it then also install >>>> an >>>> /etc/env.d/ file to add this dir to the LDPATH. >>> >>> +1 to this. I was going to suggest something similar. >>> >>> At least, because I'm still thinking in a view other than "steam", >>> and >>> anticipating "Maybe we're going to do more of this" >>> >>> If more than one binary application need more than one debian hack, >>> stuffing all the debian hacks in a special prefix that everyone can >>> use >>> without polluting the main gentoo stuff is an advantage. >>> >>> ( And the separate dir makes it clear what the library is for and >>> why >>> its there if anyone is trying to weed out some library problem that >>> still manages to happen despite our attempts ) >> >> I also like the private libdir better than installing a symlink in a >> "standard" libdir. >=20 > The question is really why, still. > I only see some sort of tidyness arguments, but it's not exactly tidy > to clobber ld.so.conf either, so I don't consider this a real argument.= >=20 > If you install a proprietary package from their .tar.bz2 or Loki .sh > installer or whatever, the user will not know to install some libpcre- > debian package. > Also, again, PCRE2 is there. Soon dev-libs/libpcre:3 (libpcre-8.*) is > primarily a binary package satisfier anyways, so why not just satisfy > libpcre.so.3 while at it. Funny fact - we have it in SLOT=3D3 too :) >=20 > Ultimately I don't care personally as a gentoo user, as I will know to > install this useless symlink package. Maybe, if I remember. And only > because of a 10+ thread. But our users are uselessly bothered when they= > actually need it by something. > They ought to be able to choose to not care, and have shit working out > of the box. This is providing a very important choice, in the spirit of= > Gentoo. >=20 >=20 > Mart >=20 We normally have our differences but I have to agree here. Getting proprietary stuff to work at all is a pain; being able to simply not care and "just make it work" would be great. I think we can do it no matter where we choose to install things. iirc the steam-meta package already includes a wrapper. Given that Valve only promises support on Ubuntu (and SteamOS which is basically Ubuntu), we should probably use a Debian/Ubuntu-specific compat dir so we can address all future kludges instead of just PCRE. But really, we should be able to make it so users can `emerge -a steam`, wait a few minutes, and be able to type "steam" into a terminal or run dialog and it "just works". Skype does it; I don't see why Steam can't, unless there's a licensing problem. (This is my perspective as a user who begrudgingly uses Skype and Steam, and has historically had more trouble from Steam) --=20 Daniel Campbell - Gentoo Developer OpenPGP Key: 0x1EA055D6 @ hkp://keys.gnupg.net fpr: AE03 9064 AE00 053C 270C 1DE4 6F7A 9091 1EA0 55D6 --0sPhvJqBg48DIo2UhVXefR7vCaDDgVcg1-- --jUMKlFBRTENC8cBx1uGkFWo8fWS9NT2sO Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2 iQIcBAEBCAAGBQJXtVBKAAoJEAEkDpRQOeFwi+QQAJ/BXhsCtOEyjqDQChn5IDpj dJI4FeUeQb4Pi1k9qIsiZltsFXgw/Qkqs6Qfis9CYL5p3IA15a23ZWSE4LzPN3+s Q00nt5n/fVDMqDkLTOdBnD7s+ps9eyHjK4wT4IfiXZf4ans7EwM5OSpd0mw6KvOH KvWaBj5AvfZ0TLq1JfMgSCmZtJQ4lW3KAx6BbGcJaTBCKLLCjq24jUXOS8LPJUVg Vxu3payM0UHuyxtTTuUxNnRn//5jOUAwxsV6k25ArKx8/qlGJNGanIKdNuJ+ZpGL rDmPRVYJtHmwUxkEkR85JCNe0x72JLwAl7lGu6R+fkepkbyrXq2DxTpItZ2zBsyq wX/oXXM0PAMOc2pmB5wCT5IpXxDSJYyR+a4VEqbUl+odCmys03QAc0iKDJdqPQna ylAWTCqn3r3xTz1y8YF90fI6mIGBUgkFx7dahKDK+Alh5YfEFGh3obctJ4AN1Ovc x75gDqQqBAc0VVjwrCG3TtzhszEhbIeqHE+4vz4mw9czWZvavYFJc9TjFVpDHVO1 sKd9km3UhP1meJjtxai/hWTbeiZAp9rxmui51Q0RzVAeplq0yN7UWcjo8SXwk9hw VOEUOHu1uaPCyskwRmh0Y58ZJ74v9SH1rhrc/p/i8V4Wg9mjA9JkH3wgV33pVrjO PnPlRmJMz4jprDz3Rhde =/IoK -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --jUMKlFBRTENC8cBx1uGkFWo8fWS9NT2sO--