From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 4.0.0 (2022-12-14) on finch.gentoo.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.0 required=5.0 tests=DMARC_MISSING, MAILING_LIST_MULTI autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no version=4.0.0 Received: from acme.geekasylum.org (acme.geekasylum.org [203.30.145.10]) by chiba.3jane.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D715ABD4F for ; Fri, 19 Apr 2002 07:04:12 -0500 (CDT) Received: from buffy (buffy.geekasylum.org [203.30.145.20]) by acme.geekasylum.org (8.11.2/8.11.2/SuSE Linux 8.11.1-0.5) with SMTP id g3JC4A909009 for ; Fri, 19 Apr 2002 22:04:10 +1000 From: "Todd Wright" To: Subject: RE: [gentoo-dev] making %95 of users happy Date: Fri, 19 Apr 2002 22:04:09 +1000 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <1019186743.2935.61.camel@silver.perimeter> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Sender: gentoo-dev-admin@gentoo.org Errors-To: gentoo-dev-admin@gentoo.org X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@gentoo.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.6 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: gentoo-dev@gentoo.org List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Gentoo Linux developer list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: X-Archives-Salt: e3139329-236c-4ecd-a316-b74c300e1568 X-Archives-Hash: e5334bf505bb0922e6160296a597592c > > > And to the person (Andrew I think) who quoted the following=20 > from the gentoo site as a reason for not having release branches... > > >=20 > > > "*Portage allows you to set up Gentoo Linux the way you like = it*..." > > >=20 > > > It doesnt. Just when I get it how I like it, it changes. >=20 > "IT changes"?? I'm at a loss here. You mean that YOU keep telling it > to change? I think that you missed Daniel Robbins point: No, I think you and the other person who suggested "dont emerge --update = world" missed mine. The problem is not emerge, or in using "--update" or "world", rather it = is in the fact that the portage tree keeps being updated constantly, and = there is no mechanism to lock things down, that allows for this. For example. I do an emerge rsync and then emerge package-a, but = package-a is broken, so later I emerge rsync again, hoping a new = package-a-r1 is available, it is, and it works, but requires lib-x at = version 1.0, which I have so it compiles all nice and everyone s happy So, package-a is done. Now I need to fix package-b which is also broken, the latest rsync I = just did for package-a also got me a new package-b-r5.ebuild package-b requires lib-x at version 1.35, but I have 1.0 so it has = lib-x-1.35 as a dependancy. The lib downloads and installs, but it = overwrites lib-x-1.0. Now package-a is broken again and wont compile, so = I wait. a new rsync gets me package-a-r2 which compiles with lib-x-1.35, = and all is happy. A week from now, I emerge rsync to see if there are any new package-c = updates and a new ebuild for lib-x-1.80 arrives but I dont install it = since the other packages wont compile with it. Thats fine, but if I ever = decide to rebuild my system from scratch (I might change motherboards = and require new optimisation) with emerge --emptytree world, (which = doesnt work btw - see bug 1911) portage goes and compiles lib-x-1.80 and = Im back to square one. The problem is not in compiling the world and being bleeding edge, it is = in the fact that the portage tree is a constantly moving target. Every = time you rsync to get a new version of one package you get the new = version of _ALL_ packages. What I have been saying all along is there needs to be a way to lock the = system at a particular level - whether it is locked by the developers or = by me, to say "this set of packages work reasonably well togehter". = This doesnt have to be guaranteed, but you should be able to say "I have = a reasonably stable system, lets keep it at this level", but still = emerge rsync to get ebuilds for vital security fixes etc which apply to = the packages that you have installed already, but nothing else. Personally, being familiar with Linux, I can live with portage the way = it is, but as a technologist I can see what others are saying, and agree = with them. Im just trying to explain it the best I can. Perhaps this will work itself out all by itself. When Gentoo 1.2 is = released and the make.profile is changed to point at the default-1.2 = profile, the bleeding edgers can use that while the more conservative = keep their link to 1.0 Thinking about it, this is probably the ultimate = solution, its just not apparent right now since Gentoo is so young, and = the only available option is to use the 1.0 profile. When there is a = choice, the current version profile will be bleeding edge, while the = previous version will only be updated with major fixes, and will become = the "stable" release. There. Ive just convinced myself. This is a temporary problem that = solves itself as Gentoo matures. -- _--_|\ --------- Todd Wright -- wylie@geekasylum.org -------- / \ =20 \_.--._* <--- http://www.dreams.darker.net/~wylie/ v Mobile: +61-403-796-001 Ph: +61-2-9521-8677 ----------------------------------------------------------------