From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7077F15802E for ; Wed, 26 Jun 2024 20:44:19 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id E41FF2BC149; Wed, 26 Jun 2024 20:44:15 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-lj1-x236.google.com (mail-lj1-x236.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::236]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 911582BC144 for ; Wed, 26 Jun 2024 20:44:15 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-lj1-x236.google.com with SMTP id 38308e7fff4ca-2ec61eeed8eso44533141fa.0 for ; Wed, 26 Jun 2024 13:44:15 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlemail.com; s=20230601; t=1719434654; x=1720039454; darn=lists.gentoo.org; h=to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version :from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=5v41mhIsAat/V4F/olifGSWmpiZQk77uHG+oe5xizew=; b=KDOD0CpoW1KeAQoP2cGZfqaFuPsCFpfz6pGHjIA3TPLN8BJHhV6R+p2mrSwspJKLtI wPAG/s7puOaBJ1FlEAXazqTVebd9oshw9iYq2VZ9b1LsH86TX0QktQJaw587i7oDhXD5 wMtI89GDKejfHT2/2WOSYcxu3buf6FZxJoVSNmkHfyb+IEYxnmdkN/v66ojWBGv/JarE oGgsTIpb4Y3ln63HOuVD8C2cH2kZI+xzp63Z9nXHDhpnerQNFgZHavOG0SoyJv2ngsyX klhmDykBOTaK1s489jvl67L8nHppM+QnUkiFg7RJTOeH/aEUTsIpSYmvfu7lHr2KESpG Fdig== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1719434654; x=1720039454; h=to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version :x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=5v41mhIsAat/V4F/olifGSWmpiZQk77uHG+oe5xizew=; b=YS9SLLoIOczQ0lFg6SnwcZHwQNCbISn+3Oa4QiOJPpFY/Zo9EMN5XZLu1EkXaen6OA oPizdHheixGGXPKywfFKcy/Pu6byKrvGC1lTmExf31xoT6wBbnAlYRztRuNZvgBaJy0x GtOMf8pTnxtC10vKY8CNJfc8ZFJ2801jXjtuhJ8tmN930gvpiCORqbzgdsPmRnhswpcj Zo0SyNEoAJVdml1j6kbA3UMHHbhdPY3eIx4Zi9KIA+FNIhjhJ9aNpPpdkepfEblxoJjm 4KV8d1QFF4ZaWSC+FegDwU89HRl0lvl4TAyapOtpS5jbbPEaUPYFBtYP0MJUY2g/oCxU rS0Q== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0Yyq3xYL+ngArdF2mPhY3WNPMda7Nj6lUZG4JOwXJhcWslnjfzg6 Y9nwDztknPuVQvdWKVN66th2UM2RtM6EnTrmSGY+mRoPLEEdT38cGqSQYzo0G0Dn38qFYdtFxre vWrZKMNv8HXYNDNd+xUzpLA2WOsGW69P2 X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IGJsybBsNFL24ZqNXvUMvAApPWR5ijAOK1/cPv+o8+DzGpmiUpOzn8BjHiM6JLYxmzP/SAN0YbbjETFhXwG/9E= X-Received: by 2002:a2e:9996:0:b0:2ec:58e8:d7a2 with SMTP id 38308e7fff4ca-2ec5b337346mr68449261fa.16.1719434653724; Wed, 26 Jun 2024 13:44:13 -0700 (PDT) Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org X-Auto-Response-Suppress: DR, RN, NRN, OOF, AutoReply MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <75654daa-c5fc-45c8-a104-fae43b9ca490@gentoo.org> In-Reply-To: From: Immolo Date: Wed, 26 Jun 2024 20:44:02 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Arch Status and Future Plans To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Archives-Salt: 3d5bac33-7929-4a4d-913a-7f9af2417d33 X-Archives-Hash: 86a8af2046d5cb79440e1c8823d71b0d Hi all, As a 32bit user on many arches I'll try to answer Flow's question below. On Wed, 26 Jun 2024 at 07:38, Florian Schmaus wrote: > > Hi Arthur, > > thanks for taking the time to write this mail. > > On 25/06/2024 19.33, Arthur Zamarin wrote: > > ======== x86 ======== > > > > Stable 32-bit arch. I'll be honest, I don't believe at all this should > > be stable arch anymore. > > I have the impression as well. The time to drop stable keywords for x86 > probably has come. But I always wonder if there is a x86 use-case we are > not aware of. Therefore, if there is a group of x86 Gentoo users out > there, then they should speak now and ideally elaborate a bit on their > use case. I personally support the move to ~arch for all 32bit arches that I use (x86, ppc and arm) as I don't feel many people are testing these platforms, so I've found generally a better experience since switching as fixes seem to get sorted a lot faster. My only concern is around running the testing toolchain on these systems as we have had 2 x86 breakages with glibc causing a user to need to reinstall in at least one occasion and there was also the issue with ppc not working with GCC13 and 14 for a very long time. Now for me I enjoy the challenge of issues like this so I wouldn't have an issue however not everyone is like me so I would advocate that we would have a system in place for a phased keywording around glibc, gcc, llvm, clang and binutils. This way users can have a stable toolchain with minimal issues and users such as myself can help you all by giving you early warning. This wouldn't have to be a permanent plan in place however, I believe it would make the transition a lot smoother for both devs and users. Bugs: https://bugs.gentoo.org/933764 https://sourceware.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=31316 Kind regards, Immolo