From mboxrd@z Thu Jan  1 00:00:00 1970
Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org ([208.92.234.80] helo=lists.gentoo.org)
	by finch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60)
	(envelope-from <gentoo-dev+bounces-51431-garchives=archives.gentoo.org@lists.gentoo.org>)
	id 1SQUOh-0007hg-C9
	for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Sat, 05 May 2012 02:06:59 +0000
Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1])
	by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 21633E0683;
	Sat,  5 May 2012 02:06:40 +0000 (UTC)
Received: from mail-bk0-f53.google.com (mail-bk0-f53.google.com [209.85.214.53])
	by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 92261E066B
	for <gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org>; Sat,  5 May 2012 02:06:05 +0000 (UTC)
Received: by bkcjk13 with SMTP id jk13so3059773bkc.40
        for <gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org>; Fri, 04 May 2012 19:06:04 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
        d=gmail.com; s=20120113;
        h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date
         :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type
         :content-transfer-encoding;
        bh=wWs9xc9HiHxVFA+igzPD7G0/+sfpulVax8V85knN+8k=;
        b=imtE4Lz+m++j5/5x7woQqu4EsZDOoOozkxEFXpRiRGdS6M3W6MGpCYAGoFkPafplUB
         QVfvzCOBKF9E7LU2IILNRR0z3KDNKipolt+dXKj7FE+FaPyD87dQFN251KEKyITp8o9B
         EZVJ3zsmelJV8VvgNsKnRH9tGUo9QnE+IqwzLpG1t2kPVxCUt9q3IjYmfqtJP8+rRvjQ
         maiikiS98RStIjidI2q4TvHfTXRSAfaIo21hzr7bUdUo6lrVmCtZAcC2HIRGYqiZV/hS
         OdX9ZJKT5qE9gmjgBNc1t1rkZ2V8+02hkX93cD7B4/gkmOwNNwZI+oH6bJf2QyXTDTax
         jw9w==
Precedence: bulk
List-Post: <mailto:gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org>
List-Help: <mailto:gentoo-dev+help@lists.gentoo.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:gentoo-dev+unsubscribe@lists.gentoo.org>
List-Subscribe: <mailto:gentoo-dev+subscribe@lists.gentoo.org>
List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail <gentoo-dev.gentoo.org>
X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org
Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org
MIME-Version: 1.0
Received: by 10.204.150.84 with SMTP id x20mr1577769bkv.26.1336183564639; Fri,
 04 May 2012 19:06:04 -0700 (PDT)
Sender: freemanrich@gmail.com
Received: by 10.204.226.77 with HTTP; Fri, 4 May 2012 19:06:04 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <4FA48777.1070503@gentoo.org>
References: <4FA2512E.7030806@gentoo.org>
	<CAGfcS_m9zwEuJES2z9Jn4jvsj7cp3KNtTNjb-rYGKp1MdfcE2g@mail.gmail.com>
	<20120503213930.GA5562@waltdnes.org>
	<CAAr7Pr8MeUpFpdCU16v49438L+fJr-XMqW_c2uMvb9MfeyT-3w@mail.gmail.com>
	<4FA419F8.8080907@gentoo.org>
	<CAJ0EP404JQozFowDtcY-Ge57-fk9amXe+rwy4uxxn6FkXMsHog@mail.gmail.com>
	<4FA421F3.9070100@gentoo.org>
	<4FA4307C.4090804@gentoo.org>
	<20120505005824.GA22763@kroah.com>
	<4FA481E9.8050803@cs.stonybrook.edu>
	<20120505013304.GA26015@kroah.com>
	<4FA48777.1070503@gentoo.org>
Date: Fri, 4 May 2012 22:06:04 -0400
X-Google-Sender-Auth: 9PrHNn04HxsCdLLTbRBg0IHjdg0
Message-ID: <CAGfcS_=STBYTu2UvThCmFSfbHpe40Kd+Bhw7qn4ExLeKW8FQ-Q@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Chromium bundled code
From: Rich Freeman <rich0@gentoo.org>
To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
X-Archives-Salt: 027c5490-b215-4e93-9f88-9a6c4ccd24ce
X-Archives-Hash: 74f3c4046aaeb195df91f039eac3edde

On Fri, May 4, 2012 at 9:50 PM, Ch=C3=AD-Thanh Christopher Nguy=E1=BB=85n
<chithanh@gentoo.org> wrote:
> I'd say that Android is an operating system based on Linux. It is not
> 'the Linux "stack"'.
> I think he was wondering whether the lock-in between dbus, udev and the
> Linux kernel will reach proportions where they will be distributed in
> one source tree.

Well, I think that all of this is at the heart of the debate.  I don't
see whether the source trees are merged as being terribly important -
the issue is whether the level of integration makes them difficult to
peel apart.

This is just the vertical integration debate all over again.  If you
want to use gnome, thou shalt use systemd.  If you want to use
Chromium, thou shalt use udev, and so on.  I can't wait until we hit
the point where if you want to use your favorite browser you have to
install the maintainer's favorite DE, sysvinit, etc.

The only solution I see to getting back to the "unix way" is to agree
upon standard APIs, but I think that is many years off.  Most of these
technologies are very new, and rapidly evolving.  Google themselves
have shown with platforms like Android that compatibility is not of
terrible importance to them beyond the application API (how many times
have they broken the camera driver binary interface?), and of course
Linux is famous for breaking driver-level binary interfaces, though
this is mitigated by the fact that outside of Android almost everybody
makes their drivers open-source, or they actually support their
drivers for more than six months.

The next year or two will be an interesting experiment for the Linux
community.  Will the "unix way" prevail, or does the future lie in
highly integrated tools, that generally do not interoperate, but which
provide much greater functionality?

Rich