From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 03AD11381F3 for ; Tue, 23 Apr 2013 16:16:13 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id ABC31E09E0; Tue, 23 Apr 2013 16:16:08 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-ie0-f182.google.com (mail-ie0-f182.google.com [209.85.223.182]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C3E01E0974 for ; Tue, 23 Apr 2013 16:16:07 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-ie0-f182.google.com with SMTP id bn7so874024ieb.41 for ; Tue, 23 Apr 2013 09:16:07 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:x-received:reply-to:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=XTK+JIso0HQl+UW1Gop3tZm4EDfHCTRC5VjY2ro7AGo=; b=Y931dPocl2qv+P7z8wnzTCniRc+E/MYLVb0mnu828GmqYzw3AhAd3aerNWkLwDmVSd 1NvqYAQ+5WkNDYk+M/MsJ9ezrQE2oNcZycZLN/DwznZWqrPygp5RcUk0QF7Wcn3DULO3 oOy/vaN2hFomrRfEVekxLx7/vHyx635+6ZZ+2Gmz7AeH/WL/9cAWiNa0so9nb0XX70Tk GFRu1FVy5459e6zk8FTmta/RLmtI0k+3uMfVFz+dsA07vIUnCTkicH3zD4MPQvNx2v8m 6HdvsSkQapFWS4eEoAuoeIRumRfzL+L8jLTzAsqtbdL80A/jxb0RKFjKX8g8vw+EXDEO lX0w== Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.50.107.106 with SMTP id hb10mr25147560igb.25.1366733767008; Tue, 23 Apr 2013 09:16:07 -0700 (PDT) Sender: yngwin@gmail.com Received: by 10.64.30.234 with HTTP; Tue, 23 Apr 2013 09:16:06 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <20130422191338.6c71482b@pomiocik.lan> References: <20130419091632.D01152171D@flycatcher.gentoo.org> <20130419153043.30ffc50c@portable> <5173F9F7.6050100@gentoo.org> <20130422191338.6c71482b@pomiocik.lan> Date: Wed, 24 Apr 2013 00:16:06 +0800 X-Google-Sender-Auth: QvteS1URK4ymWHBS8dSHhqrVzzs Message-ID: Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: [gentoo-commits] gentoo-x86 commit in profiles: ChangeLog package.mask From: Ben de Groot To: =?UTF-8?B?TWljaGHFgiBHw7Nybnk=?= Cc: gentoo-dev Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=e89a8f643b6eaf6c0e04db098000 X-Archives-Salt: 29786bfa-f83d-4b95-80a7-72389a62d3d8 X-Archives-Hash: 8240bdad759d492ef7d9147805873b61 --e89a8f643b6eaf6c0e04db098000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 23 April 2013 01:13, Micha=C5=82 G=C3=B3rny wrote: > On Mon, 22 Apr 2013 19:43:22 +0800 > Ben de Groot wrote: > > > On 21 April 2013 22:38, Ch=C3=AD-Thanh Christopher Nguy=E1=BB=85n < > chithanh@gentoo.org>wrote: > > > > > Denis Dupeyron schrieb: > > > > I'm hoping this kind of immature and abrasive behaviours will not > > > > propagate (notice the plural here). Yes, when you see a package bei= ng > > > > actively maintained by somebody else you should absolutely not touc= h > > > > it without talking to that person or team first. > > > > > > I fail to see any wrong behavior here. A bug report was created and a > > > review > > > of the changes was requested. The first reaction came after several > weeks > > > after the bug filing, and the first objection almost two months after > the > > > change was applied. > > > https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3D455074 > > > > > > > You are missing an important part of the story. > > See https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3D455070 where we discuss > > the same issue for freetype. (Yes I should have been explicit for > fontconfig > > too, my bad.) > > > > I initially reacted within hours, saying that his proposal was in my ey= es > > not ready yet. I assumed I was clear enough in my refusal, but > > apparently Micha=C5=82 didn't understand it that way. He then contacted > > the herd a few weeks later, when I was on holiday, and got Luca's > permission > > to commit, not taking into account he hadn't touched those packages in > > many years. > > Just to be clear -- I misunderstood you indeed. I know, and it's water under the bridge. We're people and we make mistakes sometimes. Let's move on. > I thought you mean that > you would agree if the idea is discussed and the discussion results in > a general agreement on proceeding with the solution. That and ample testing. I think it has been going all a bit too quick, with the eclass(es) in flux, and so on. I'm still not convinced it's mature enough at this point, which is why I believe this should still be masked. As to the discussion, I see only a few people speaking up, but obviously you cannot be blamed for the silent majority. But it's starting to look more and more like I'm the only one objecting at this point. So maybe I should stop being cautious (or even cranky) and let you guys go ahead and do your work. I do need someone to co-maintain freetype and fontconfig then, as I am personally still not happy with these changes and the maintenance burden they create. > > After I found out, I was a bit pissed off about it, but I was too busy > with > > work to deal with it (and thought it wise to cool down a bit before > taking > > action). I then saw bug reports about the freetype multilib ebuild > revision > > flooding in, and was satisfied after it got masked. > > Those bugs weren't relevant to the final version of the ebuild which > you have masked. The only actual bug left open was the one which I > forgot to close after fixing it instantly after it was opened. > > So please don't say that I don't take responsibility for my changes. I'm not saying that at all. You respond quickly. I can only commend you on that. But I do have doubts about long term maintainance. I know you are more than willing to do your part, but it's simply beyond any one person to (co-)maintain half the tree. --=20 Cheers, Ben | yngwin Gentoo developer Gentoo Qt project lead, Gentoo Wiki admin --e89a8f643b6eaf6c0e04db098000 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On 23 April 2013 01:13, Micha=C5=82 G=C3=B3rny <mgorny@= gentoo.org> wrote:
On Mon, 22 Apr 2013 19:43:22 +0800
Ben de Groot <yng= win@gentoo.org> wrote:

> On 21 April 2013 22:38, Ch=C3=AD-Thanh Christo= pher Nguy=E1=BB=85n <chithanh@gen= too.org>wrote:
>
> > Denis Dupeyron schrieb:
> > > I'm hoping this kind of immature and abrasive behaviours= will not
> > > propagate (notice the plural here). Yes, when you see a pack= age being
> > > actively maintained by somebody else you should absolutely n= ot touch
> > > it without talking to that person or team first.
> >
> > I fail to see any wrong behavior here. A bug report was created a= nd a
> > review
> > of the changes was requested. The first reaction came after sever= al weeks
> > after the bug filing, and the first objection almost two months a= fter the
> > change was applied.
> > https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3D455074
> >
>
> You are missing an important part of the story.
> See https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3D455070 where we = discuss
> the same issue for freetype. (Yes I should have been explicit for font= config
> too, my bad.)
>
> I initially reacted within hours, saying that his proposal was in my e= yes
> not ready yet. I assumed I was clear enough in my refusal, but
> apparently Micha=C5=82 didn't understand it that way. He then cont= acted
> the herd a few weeks later, when I was on holiday, and got Luca's = permission
> to commit, not taking into account he hadn't touched those package= s in
> many years.

Just to be clear -- I misunderstood you indeed.

=
I know, and it's water under the bridge. We're peo= ple and we make mistakes=C2=A0
sometimes. Let's move on= .
=C2=A0
I thought you mean that you would agree if the idea is discussed and the discussion results in
a general agreement on proceeding with the solution.

<= /div>
That and ample testing. I think it has been going all a bit= too quick, with=C2=A0
the eclass(es) in flux, and so on. I= 'm still not convinced it's mature enough=C2=A0
at this point, which is why I believe this should still be maske= d.

As to the discussion, I see only a = few people speaking up, but obviously
you cannot be blamed = for the silent majority.

But it's starting to look more and more= like I'm the only one objecting
at this point. So mayb= e I should stop being cautious (or even cranky)
and let you= guys go ahead and do your work. I do need someone to
co-maintain freetype and fontconfig then, as I am personally sti= ll not
happy with these changes and the maintenance burden = they create.
=C2=A0
> After I found out, I was a bit pissed off about it, but I was too busy= with
> work to deal with it (and thought it wise to cool down a bit before ta= king
> action). I then saw bug reports about the freetype multilib ebuild rev= ision
> flooding in, and was satisfied after it got masked.

Those bugs weren't relevant to the final version of the ebuild wh= ich
you have masked. The only actual bug left open was the one which I
forgot to close after fixing it instantly after it was opened.

So please don't say that I don't take responsibility for my changes= .

I'm not saying that at all. You= respond quickly. I can only commend you
on that.=C2=A0

But I do have doubts about long = term maintainance. I know you are=C2=A0
mor= e than willing to do your part, but it's simply beyond any one
person to (co-)maintain half the tree.

-- <= br>Cheers,

Ben | yngwin
Gentoo developer
Gentoo Qt project lea= d, Gentoo Wiki admin
--e89a8f643b6eaf6c0e04db098000--