From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org ([208.92.234.80] helo=lists.gentoo.org) by finch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1R6uCK-00052J-Od for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Fri, 23 Sep 2011 01:05:01 +0000 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id DE46321C1A4; Fri, 23 Sep 2011 01:04:50 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-vw0-f53.google.com (mail-vw0-f53.google.com [209.85.212.53]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 46AE521C180 for ; Fri, 23 Sep 2011 01:04:21 +0000 (UTC) Received: by vws19 with SMTP id 19so625789vws.40 for ; Thu, 22 Sep 2011 18:04:21 -0700 (PDT) Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.52.38.99 with SMTP id f3mr2596517vdk.392.1316739861661; Thu, 22 Sep 2011 18:04:21 -0700 (PDT) Sender: antarus@scriptkitty.com Received: by 10.52.158.99 with HTTP; Thu, 22 Sep 2011 18:04:21 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <20110923004129.GA3589@comet> References: <20110916030019.GA5000@comet> <20110916090605.GD16239@localhost> <20110916123014.GC5000@comet> <20110916204315.GA30103@beast> <20110918035908.GB4525@comet.mayo.edu> <20110918112238.GB6005@localhost> <20110919031646.GA7635@comet> <20110920212057.GA14344@beast> <20110921131156.GA3640@comet> <20110923004129.GA3589@comet> Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2011 18:04:21 -0700 X-Google-Sender-Auth: edAUeVsDUhYnK_l1lTFw_HgI_fc Message-ID: Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] new `usex` helper From: Alec Warner To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Archives-Salt: X-Archives-Hash: 32c087412c02c36faa0fcec22961f4cd On Thu, Sep 22, 2011 at 5:41 PM, Donnie Berkholz wro= te: > On 09:37 Wed 21 Sep =C2=A0 =C2=A0 , Alec Warner wrote: >> On Wed, Sep 21, 2011 at 6:11 AM, Donnie Berkholz = wrote: >> > Not really, because when you update a bundled lib you actually make >> > your whole app compile with it. People change the APIs of eclasses >> > and then just let every internal consumer (ebuilds in gentoo-x86) >> > break. Maybe if we put the burden on the one who changed the API, >> > like the Linux kernel model, it would bother me less. >> >> I think people do this for three reasons. >> >> 1) There are no refactoring tools that I know of for bash. >> 2) There exist some package maintainers that will yell at you if you >> touch their packages for any reason. > > To refer to the Linux model again, you send patches to the maintainers, > and they just commit them. This is much less effort than figuring out to > handle some incomprehensible change to an already weird eclass and then > sorting out how to deal with it across 20 or 30 packages. In my experience maintainers do not 'just commit my patches.' But perhaps I'm crazy. > >> 3) Breaking things means they get fixed. >> >> We have this notify -> deprecate -> break workflow; I actually don't >> mind it (but only because I've seen it used elsewhere.) > > I do, because I don't have time to deal with other people breaking my > packages, whether they're in gentoo-x86, the science overlay, or my > personal one. I've got more important things to deal with, within Gentoo > and in the rest of my life. You don't have time to fix breakages but you have time to do code reviews? I put a code review system in the infra survey because I think bugzilla is a poor way to track changes to the tree and there is not a good way to get feedback or track updates. I think if we had streamlined tools for this I'd be less concerned about mailing out changes to 60 or 100 or 1000 packages and having any sane idea which packages were fixed, which were pending, which packages I had not heard from someone in a while.. etc... -A > > -- > Thanks, > Donnie > > Donnie Berkholz > Council Member / Sr. Developer > Gentoo Linux > Blog: http://dberkholz.com >