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* [gentoo-dev] kernel PCMCIA
@ 2002-04-19 14:37 Gert Dewit
  2002-04-19 14:48 ` Chad M. Huneycutt
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread
From: Gert Dewit @ 2002-04-19 14:37 UTC (permalink / raw
  To: gentoo-dev

I've posted following message on the gentoo-install forum, but I'd like to
know from you guys why gentoo is using the non-kernel PCMCIA stuff from
pcmcia-cs in the install initrd.

> I've tried to install gentoo on my laptop with a PCMCIA network card that's
> only supported by the kernel drivers and not by the pcmcia-cs drivers.

> Several new PCMCIA cards work by using the PCI hotplug interface so I guess
> other people will run in the same problems as I did.

> To get gentoo installed anyway I created a new iso file with kernel
> (2.4.19)> PCMCIA support, all possible modules (network and others) and pcmcia-cs
> compiled against it.

> BTW: I've added a minimal vim version also, can't live without vi :-)

> If somebody is interested I'll put the iso file up for download.

Groeten,

Gert




^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread

* Re: [gentoo-dev] kernel PCMCIA
  2002-04-19 14:37 Gert Dewit
@ 2002-04-19 14:48 ` Chad M. Huneycutt
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: Chad M. Huneycutt @ 2002-04-19 14:48 UTC (permalink / raw
  To: gentoo-dev

Gert Dewit wrote:
> I've posted following message on the gentoo-install forum, but I'd like to
> know from you guys why gentoo is using the non-kernel PCMCIA stuff from
> pcmcia-cs in the install initrd.

Daniel put that on the install CD per my recommendation.  My understanding 
is that pcmcia-cs has newer/more drivers than the kernel.  If this is no 
longer correct, then we can certainly switch to kernel-only modules on the 
CD in the future.

Chad (chadh@gentoo.org)



^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread

* Re: [gentoo-dev] kernel PCMCIA
       [not found] <20020419170103.C117AAC6D0@chiba.3jane.net>
@ 2002-04-19 18:22 ` Gert Dewit
  2002-04-19 19:20   ` Chad M. Huneycutt
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread
From: Gert Dewit @ 2002-04-19 18:22 UTC (permalink / raw
  To: gentoo-dev

On Fri, 2002-04-19 at 1048, Chad wrote:
> Gert Dewit wrote:
> > I've posted following message on the gentoo-install forum, but I'd like to
> > know from you guys why gentoo is using the non-kernel PCMCIA stuff from
> > pcmcia-cs in the install initrd.
> 
> Daniel put that on the install CD per my recommendation.  My understanding 
> is that pcmcia-cs has newer/more drivers than the kernel.  If this is no 
> longer correct, then we can certainly switch to kernel-only modules on the 
> CD in the future.

I'm affraid it's not that simple. As up to kernel version 2.4.16 or so 
you were right that the pcmcia-cs drivers were more stable and had more
supported cards. Today I'm not sure about the situation. As far as I 
know there are cards that are only supported by the kernel drivers
(the D-Link DFE 690TXD I use for instance as well as other cards that 
are supported by their pci drivers) and there are cards that are only
supported by the pcmcia-cs drivers.

The best way to go I think is use the kernel PCMCIA infrastructure
and drivers and add the pcmcia-cs "clients" (drivers) and cardmanager
utils. I think this is the strategy the RedHat boys also use.

If you want me to check it out, just say so, I've got some spare time
while my new gentoo system is building on my laptop.

Groeten,

Gert
-- 
"UNIX is simple. It just takes a genius to understand its simplicity."
                                         -- Dennis Ritchie



^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread

* Re: [gentoo-dev] kernel PCMCIA
  2002-04-19 18:22 ` Gert Dewit
@ 2002-04-19 19:20   ` Chad M. Huneycutt
  2002-04-19 21:56     ` Gert Dewit
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread
From: Chad M. Huneycutt @ 2002-04-19 19:20 UTC (permalink / raw
  To: gentoo-dev

Gert Dewit wrote:
> On Fri, 2002-04-19 at 1048, Chad wrote:
>>Gert Dewit wrote:
>>>I've posted following message on the gentoo-install forum, but I'd like to
>>>know from you guys why gentoo is using the non-kernel PCMCIA stuff from
>>>pcmcia-cs in the install initrd.
>>
>>Daniel put that on the install CD per my recommendation.  My understanding 
>>is that pcmcia-cs has newer/more drivers than the kernel.  If this is no 
>>longer correct, then we can certainly switch to kernel-only modules on the 
>>CD in the future.
> 
> I'm affraid it's not that simple. As up to kernel version 2.4.16 or so 
> you were right that the pcmcia-cs drivers were more stable and had more
> supported cards. Today I'm not sure about the situation. As far as I 
> know there are cards that are only supported by the kernel drivers
> (the D-Link DFE 690TXD I use for instance as well as other cards that 
> are supported by their pci drivers) and there are cards that are only
> supported by the pcmcia-cs drivers.

I was afraid that would happen eventually.

> The best way to go I think is use the kernel PCMCIA infrastructure
> and drivers and add the pcmcia-cs "clients" (drivers) and cardmanager
> utils. I think this is the strategy the RedHat boys also use.

I don't understand how the two sets of modules could co-exist, but if it 
is possible, then I am all for it.


> If you want me to check it out, just say so, I've got some spare time
> while my new gentoo system is building on my laptop.

By all means, please.  Another option is to provide pcmcia-cs sources on 
the CD, so that if someone really needs it, they can build them from a 
stage2 system.



^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread

* RE: [gentoo-dev] kernel PCMCIA
@ 2002-04-19 19:50 Sean P. Kane
  2002-04-19 20:26 ` Chad M. Huneycutt
  2002-04-20  9:03 ` Dan Armak
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: Sean P. Kane @ 2002-04-19 19:50 UTC (permalink / raw
  To: gentoo-dev

Chad, 

How hard would it be to add the modify the pcmcia-cs ebuild so that it
could be set to keep the configured source under
/usr/src/pcmcia-cs-"version number"? 

Since someone has done this already with the kernel sources, I figured
it might be quicker for someone here to do that part and then I would be
willing to create a new ebuild for the linux-wlan-ng package I was
talking about earlier. However, I need access to the configured
pcmcia-cs sources. I compiled wlan-ng by hand on my Gentoo system and it
works great (once I updated to the newest Intel ACPI patch so the system
would assign IRQs to my PCMCIA system). My wireless pcmcia card comes up
and I can browse the net fine. Since these drivers offer very good
support for the most widely used wireless chipset, Intersil's Prism2, I
think this is something that a lot of people would probably like.

Sean

-----Original Message-----
From: Chad M. Huneycutt [mailto:chad.huneycutt@acm.org] 
Sent: Friday, April 19, 2002 12:20
To: gentoo-dev@gentoo.org
Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] kernel PCMCIA


Gert Dewit wrote:
> On Fri, 2002-04-19 at 1048, Chad wrote:
>>Gert Dewit wrote:
>>>I've posted following message on the gentoo-install forum, but I'd 
>>>like to know from you guys why gentoo is using the non-kernel PCMCIA 
>>>stuff from pcmcia-cs in the install initrd.
>>
>>Daniel put that on the install CD per my recommendation.  My 
>>understanding
>>is that pcmcia-cs has newer/more drivers than the kernel.  If this is
no 
>>longer correct, then we can certainly switch to kernel-only modules on
the 
>>CD in the future.
> 
> I'm affraid it's not that simple. As up to kernel version 2.4.16 or so
> you were right that the pcmcia-cs drivers were more stable and had
more
> supported cards. Today I'm not sure about the situation. As far as I 
> know there are cards that are only supported by the kernel drivers
> (the D-Link DFE 690TXD I use for instance as well as other cards that 
> are supported by their pci drivers) and there are cards that are only
> supported by the pcmcia-cs drivers.

I was afraid that would happen eventually.

> The best way to go I think is use the kernel PCMCIA infrastructure and

> drivers and add the pcmcia-cs "clients" (drivers) and cardmanager 
> utils. I think this is the strategy the RedHat boys also use.

I don't understand how the two sets of modules could co-exist, but if it

is possible, then I am all for it.


> If you want me to check it out, just say so, I've got some spare time 
> while my new gentoo system is building on my laptop.

By all means, please.  Another option is to provide pcmcia-cs sources on

the CD, so that if someone really needs it, they can build them from a 
stage2 system.

_______________________________________________
gentoo-dev mailing list
gentoo-dev@gentoo.org
http://lists.gentoo.org/mailman/listinfo/gentoo-dev


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread

* Re: [gentoo-dev] kernel PCMCIA
  2002-04-19 19:50 Sean P. Kane
@ 2002-04-19 20:26 ` Chad M. Huneycutt
  2002-04-20  9:03 ` Dan Armak
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: Chad M. Huneycutt @ 2002-04-19 20:26 UTC (permalink / raw
  To: gentoo-dev

Sean P. Kane wrote:
> Chad, 
> 
> How hard would it be to add the modify the pcmcia-cs ebuild so that it
> could be set to keep the configured source under
> /usr/src/pcmcia-cs-"version number"? 

I actually think the better solution may be to just add the wlan-ng 
stuff to the pcmcia-cs ebuild (am I repeating myself? I might have 
already suggested this).  Is there some reason why this won't work?

Chad



^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread

* RE: [gentoo-dev] kernel PCMCIA
@ 2002-04-19 20:53 Sean P. Kane
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: Sean P. Kane @ 2002-04-19 20:53 UTC (permalink / raw
  To: gentoo-dev

Well, here is my concern with this. The wlan-ng stuff contains the
Prism2 drivers for PCI, USB, PCX (?), and PCMCIA. It would be pretty
unintuitive to have non-PCMCIA drives in the PCMCIA package, when they
should really be in the kernel package. Now, I suppose we could add the
wlan-ng sources to the kernel and the PCMCIA ebuilds, and have the
config compile for everything but PCMCIA in the kernel ebuild case and
then have the package compile for only the PCMCIA stuff when compiling
the PCMCIA-cs package. This seems like a bit of a pain to maintain, but
maybe it is the best solution. I'd lean towards having a unique package
as maintaining it would be easier especially if the other option ends up
placing it into two different ebuilds, however in this case I need
access to the pcmcia-cs configured source. 

What are your thoughts on that?

Thanks,
Sean


-----Original Message-----
From: Chad M. Huneycutt [mailto:chad.huneycutt@acm.org] 
Sent: Friday, April 19, 2002 13:26
To: gentoo-dev@gentoo.org
Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] kernel PCMCIA


Sean P. Kane wrote:
> Chad,
> 
> How hard would it be to add the modify the pcmcia-cs ebuild so that it

> could be set to keep the configured source under 
> /usr/src/pcmcia-cs-"version number"?

I actually think the better solution may be to just add the wlan-ng 
stuff to the pcmcia-cs ebuild (am I repeating myself? I might have 
already suggested this).  Is there some reason why this won't work?

Chad

_______________________________________________
gentoo-dev mailing list
gentoo-dev@gentoo.org
http://lists.gentoo.org/mailman/listinfo/gentoo-dev


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread

* Re: [gentoo-dev] kernel PCMCIA
  2002-04-19 19:20   ` Chad M. Huneycutt
@ 2002-04-19 21:56     ` Gert Dewit
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: Gert Dewit @ 2002-04-19 21:56 UTC (permalink / raw
  To: gentoo-dev

On Fri, 2002-04-19 at 21:20, Chad M. Huneycutt wrote:
[snipped a lot of angle brackets]
> Gert wrote :
> > If you want me to check it out, just say so, I've got some spare time
> > while my new gentoo system is building on my laptop.
> 
> By all means, please.

OK, I've checked it out and it seems to look less complicated than it
used to.

I've checked the SRPMS for the kernel and pcmcia packages from RedHat
and they don't use none of the drivers from pcmcia-cs anymore, only
the utilities and config files. As they target a quite large audience
(including desktops) I suppose most of the cards are supported by kernel
modules.

This means however that pci hotplug needs to be on the install iso
(it appears to be in the portage tree).

Something else that should be looked at will be the /etc/pcmcia/config
file because the module names won't be right for all instances.

If I can be of any further assistance, just YELL.

Groeten,

Gert
-- 
"UNIX is simple. It just takes a genius to understand its simplicity."
                                         -- Dennis Ritchie



^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread

* Re: [gentoo-dev] kernel PCMCIA
  2002-04-19 19:50 Sean P. Kane
  2002-04-19 20:26 ` Chad M. Huneycutt
@ 2002-04-20  9:03 ` Dan Armak
  2002-04-21 11:48   ` Spider
  1 sibling, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread
From: Dan Armak @ 2002-04-20  9:03 UTC (permalink / raw
  To: gentoo-dev

On Friday 19 April 2002 22:50, Sean P. Kane wrote:
> Chad,
>
> How hard would it be to add the modify the pcmcia-cs ebuild so that it
> could be set to keep the configured source under
> /usr/src/pcmcia-cs-"version number"?
>
> Since someone has done this already with the kernel sources, I figured
> it might be quicker for someone here to do that part and then I would be
> willing to create a new ebuild for the linux-wlan-ng package I was
> talking about earlier. However, I need access to the configured
> pcmcia-cs sources. I compiled wlan-ng by hand on my Gentoo system and it
> works great (once I updated to the newest Intel ACPI patch so the system
> would assign IRQs to my PCMCIA system). My wireless pcmcia card comes up
> and I can browse the net fine. Since these drivers offer very good
> support for the most widely used wireless chipset, Intersil's Prism2, I
> think this is something that a lot of people would probably like.

A little OT: how are they better than the kernel's orinoco_cs? I use that with 
my prism2-based pcmcia wireless and it, well, works.

>
> Sean
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Chad M. Huneycutt [mailto:chad.huneycutt@acm.org]
> Sent: Friday, April 19, 2002 12:20
> To: gentoo-dev@gentoo.org
> Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] kernel PCMCIA
>
> Gert Dewit wrote:
> > On Fri, 2002-04-19 at 1048, Chad wrote:
> >>Gert Dewit wrote:
> >>>I've posted following message on the gentoo-install forum, but I'd
> >>>like to know from you guys why gentoo is using the non-kernel PCMCIA
> >>>stuff from pcmcia-cs in the install initrd.
> >>
> >>Daniel put that on the install CD per my recommendation.  My
> >>understanding
> >>is that pcmcia-cs has newer/more drivers than the kernel.  If this is
>
> no
>
> >>longer correct, then we can certainly switch to kernel-only modules on
>
> the
>
> >>CD in the future.
> >
> > I'm affraid it's not that simple. As up to kernel version 2.4.16 or so
> > you were right that the pcmcia-cs drivers were more stable and had
>
> more
>
> > supported cards. Today I'm not sure about the situation. As far as I
> > know there are cards that are only supported by the kernel drivers
> > (the D-Link DFE 690TXD I use for instance as well as other cards that
> > are supported by their pci drivers) and there are cards that are only
> > supported by the pcmcia-cs drivers.
>
> I was afraid that would happen eventually.
>
> > The best way to go I think is use the kernel PCMCIA infrastructure and
> >
> > drivers and add the pcmcia-cs "clients" (drivers) and cardmanager
> > utils. I think this is the strategy the RedHat boys also use.
>
> I don't understand how the two sets of modules could co-exist, but if it
>
> is possible, then I am all for it.
>
> > If you want me to check it out, just say so, I've got some spare time
> > while my new gentoo system is building on my laptop.
>
> By all means, please.  Another option is to provide pcmcia-cs sources on
>
> the CD, so that if someone really needs it, they can build them from a
> stage2 system.
>
> _______________________________________________
> gentoo-dev mailing list
> gentoo-dev@gentoo.org
> http://lists.gentoo.org/mailman/listinfo/gentoo-dev
> _______________________________________________
> gentoo-dev mailing list
> gentoo-dev@gentoo.org
> http://lists.gentoo.org/mailman/listinfo/gentoo-dev

-- 
Dan Armak
Gentoo Linux developer (KDE)
Matan, Israel


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread

* RE: [gentoo-dev] kernel PCMCIA
@ 2002-04-20 18:48 Sean P. Kane
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: Sean P. Kane @ 2002-04-20 18:48 UTC (permalink / raw
  To: gentoo-dev

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 4176 bytes --]

The orinico_cs drive does not work with as many Prism based cards and these drivers actually support the Prism2, Prism2.5 and Prism3 based cards. They are also in very active development which means that they are staying current and being constantly improved. It just seems that these are probably the strongest Prism drivers out there at the moment.

Sean

-----Original Message-----
From:	Dan Armak [mailto:danarmak@gentoo.org]
Sent:	Sat 4/20/2002 2:03 AM
To:	gentoo-dev@gentoo.org
Cc:	
Subject:	Re: [gentoo-dev] kernel PCMCIA
On Friday 19 April 2002 22:50, Sean P. Kane wrote:
> Chad,
>
> How hard would it be to add the modify the pcmcia-cs ebuild so that it
> could be set to keep the configured source under
> /usr/src/pcmcia-cs-"version number"?
>
> Since someone has done this already with the kernel sources, I figured
> it might be quicker for someone here to do that part and then I would be
> willing to create a new ebuild for the linux-wlan-ng package I was
> talking about earlier. However, I need access to the configured
> pcmcia-cs sources. I compiled wlan-ng by hand on my Gentoo system and it
> works great (once I updated to the newest Intel ACPI patch so the system
> would assign IRQs to my PCMCIA system). My wireless pcmcia card comes up
> and I can browse the net fine. Since these drivers offer very good
> support for the most widely used wireless chipset, Intersil's Prism2, I
> think this is something that a lot of people would probably like.

A little OT: how are they better than the kernel's orinoco_cs? I use that with 
my prism2-based pcmcia wireless and it, well, works.

>
> Sean
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Chad M. Huneycutt [mailto:chad.huneycutt@acm.org]
> Sent: Friday, April 19, 2002 12:20
> To: gentoo-dev@gentoo.org
> Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] kernel PCMCIA
>
> Gert Dewit wrote:
> > On Fri, 2002-04-19 at 1048, Chad wrote:
> >>Gert Dewit wrote:
> >>>I've posted following message on the gentoo-install forum, but I'd
> >>>like to know from you guys why gentoo is using the non-kernel PCMCIA
> >>>stuff from pcmcia-cs in the install initrd.
> >>
> >>Daniel put that on the install CD per my recommendation.  My
> >>understanding
> >>is that pcmcia-cs has newer/more drivers than the kernel.  If this is
>
> no
>
> >>longer correct, then we can certainly switch to kernel-only modules on
>
> the
>
> >>CD in the future.
> >
> > I'm affraid it's not that simple. As up to kernel version 2.4.16 or so
> > you were right that the pcmcia-cs drivers were more stable and had
>
> more
>
> > supported cards. Today I'm not sure about the situation. As far as I
> > know there are cards that are only supported by the kernel drivers
> > (the D-Link DFE 690TXD I use for instance as well as other cards that
> > are supported by their pci drivers) and there are cards that are only
> > supported by the pcmcia-cs drivers.
>
> I was afraid that would happen eventually.
>
> > The best way to go I think is use the kernel PCMCIA infrastructure and
> >
> > drivers and add the pcmcia-cs "clients" (drivers) and cardmanager
> > utils. I think this is the strategy the RedHat boys also use.
>
> I don't understand how the two sets of modules could co-exist, but if it
>
> is possible, then I am all for it.
>
> > If you want me to check it out, just say so, I've got some spare time
> > while my new gentoo system is building on my laptop.
>
> By all means, please.  Another option is to provide pcmcia-cs sources on
>
> the CD, so that if someone really needs it, they can build them from a
> stage2 system.
>
> _______________________________________________
> gentoo-dev mailing list
> gentoo-dev@gentoo.org
> http://lists.gentoo.org/mailman/listinfo/gentoo-dev
> _______________________________________________
> gentoo-dev mailing list
> gentoo-dev@gentoo.org
> http://lists.gentoo.org/mailman/listinfo/gentoo-dev

-- 
Dan Armak
Gentoo Linux developer (KDE)
Matan, Israel
_______________________________________________
gentoo-dev mailing list
gentoo-dev@gentoo.org
http://lists.gentoo.org/mailman/listinfo/gentoo-dev




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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread

* Re: [gentoo-dev] kernel PCMCIA
  2002-04-20  9:03 ` Dan Armak
@ 2002-04-21 11:48   ` Spider
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: Spider @ 2002-04-21 11:48 UTC (permalink / raw
  To: gentoo-dev

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 639 bytes --]

begin  quote
On Sat, 20 Apr 2002 12:03:20 +0300
Dan Armak <danarmak@gentoo.org> wrote:

> 
> A little OT: how are they better than the kernel's orinoco_cs? I use
> that with my prism2-based pcmcia wireless and it, well, works.

I get a lot of errors with cannot write to BAP with the orinoco_cs
drivers in the kernel, something that kills all transmitted data for
extended periods until reloading the drivers by force... not pleasant,
although I have a lucent Silver card (orinoco)

//Spider


--
begin  .signature
This is a .signature virus! Please copy me into your .signature!
See Microsoft KB Article Q265230 for more information.
end

[-- Attachment #2: Type: application/pgp-signature, Size: 189 bytes --]

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread

end of thread, other threads:[~2002-04-21 11:47 UTC | newest]

Thread overview: 11+ messages (download: mbox.gz follow: Atom feed
-- links below jump to the message on this page --
2002-04-19 20:53 [gentoo-dev] kernel PCMCIA Sean P. Kane
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2002-04-20 18:48 Sean P. Kane
2002-04-19 19:50 Sean P. Kane
2002-04-19 20:26 ` Chad M. Huneycutt
2002-04-20  9:03 ` Dan Armak
2002-04-21 11:48   ` Spider
     [not found] <20020419170103.C117AAC6D0@chiba.3jane.net>
2002-04-19 18:22 ` Gert Dewit
2002-04-19 19:20   ` Chad M. Huneycutt
2002-04-19 21:56     ` Gert Dewit
2002-04-19 14:37 Gert Dewit
2002-04-19 14:48 ` Chad M. Huneycutt

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