From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org ([208.92.234.80] helo=lists.gentoo.org) by finch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1QbJ2W-0000mW-6h for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Mon, 27 Jun 2011 21:08:16 +0000 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id AFD9E1C163; Mon, 27 Jun 2011 21:08:07 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-fx0-f52.google.com (mail-fx0-f52.google.com [209.85.161.52]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 891211C171 for ; Mon, 27 Jun 2011 21:07:37 +0000 (UTC) Received: by fxd18 with SMTP id 18so2151990fxd.11 for ; Mon, 27 Jun 2011 14:07:36 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=2sU7ljBpefglE+ZogMUmD0ijETLR/jw9ImrFRrE+jic=; b=w35HlKsk99HdVLa8Wy0n0z/T4yO1efuj2p/xK//Bhs/96paDita2qTtpwHGi+ZoYC7 azjJd1WHMgXHw7Pnw4eleaFYLhrrWBTc+6tLgRMM1e3UKoD6u28gFuRo3JzyQR6LuQxG P1sHfAaYRh/1UbdKKReWg8spl6rPRtFWyhPL4= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=sTAiw5LR4rD3xeVHt38n7JPfzBflbGQH1ylN+zcGwgF8fzKmIoOBNX9EEmlB5YCLLp QF46MoMqWjNz/96yWzctakkgUczPtW6eFHbl6lLke9m6K6PnadE1bmfF9y35hc6Mt+Wj tF2QhqHxt0012TUOVQhDMF7SQc/cPfAv2rvcs= Received: by 10.223.89.136 with SMTP id e8mr1559672fam.44.1309208797086; Mon, 27 Jun 2011 14:06:37 -0700 (PDT) Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.223.79.10 with HTTP; Mon, 27 Jun 2011 14:06:17 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <20110626080257.12d523ef@googlemail.com> <201106261712.27665.reavertm@gmail.com> <20110627064924.499c488c@googlemail.com> From: Wyatt Epp Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2011 17:06:17 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Are tags just sets? To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Archives-Salt: X-Archives-Hash: 697b0e3157ce9703592c30cc8a6e1a31 On Mon, Jun 27, 2011 at 16:23, Rich Freeman wrote: > I too feel that tags should be distinct from sets, for a bunch of reasons= . > > Sets should really be something carefully controlled by the > repository. =C2=A0While I'm fine with having tags in the repository also, > there is talk about giving users ways of supplying them as well. > Too late; /etc/portage/sets/ > Sets are generally used to tell the package manager to do something > with a lot of packages at once. =C2=A0I'm not sure there is much of a nee= d > to do this with tags, at least not in most of the use cases that have > been suggested. > At the moment, yes, that's very true. But that's a matter of lacking tools, more than a necessarily orthogonal concept. If you look at sets (or categories), you find they describe attributes of packages. For example, @world is "everything the user has merged". The kde overlay provides things like @kde-live, "kde packages built from subversion" (it's more specific than ${PN} in this case, but generally won't need to be). I don't think anyone here believes this feature exists without some tool support to glue it together. > Maybe if we define multiple namespaces for tags we could move to using > tags as dependencies or whatever, and those tags would be distinct and > much more carefully defined and controlled. =C2=A0However, I think this i= s > more far-out and not the immediate goal. > I'd say that's rather unnecessary. We should be wary of conflating all metadata together in our heads: Tags are not a replacement for structured key-value that we already have. When we talk of tags, we're talking about general purpose semantic descriptors that are only loosely structured and benefit from emergent community standards. We already have the things that benefit from rigid definition. > Sets might work, but they seem a bit like a hack... > Oh, absolutely. But nearly anything is better than the current state of affairs; if it falls apart, we find a different way.