From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org ([208.92.234.80] helo=lists.gentoo.org) by finch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1QAKia-0008Hg-5P for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 11:28:12 +0000 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id DD3A51C0AE; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 11:28:02 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-ey0-f181.google.com (mail-ey0-f181.google.com [209.85.215.181]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0CC6F1C09F for ; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 11:27:35 +0000 (UTC) Received: by eyh5 with SMTP id 5so507964eyh.40 for ; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 04:27:35 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=GE6UJbwAksvWv2X6+8BY/ldjEzEA4KC6v1y3uP4OlF8=; b=s7o4M0UusBTFeP4Wl5CMZNimhapMb03u+w+ALKZfppEpTUVNZbhQgXQ4JKWRkGI1Y/ 0A1a1zle0q/sahmV4bbpMvj/Vq45XUl7zs+3NQti8cAVHNOC1EF9RTPO1iHP/ZMj2hjG GC4kOVyrUs5Rm/DtfBxllTugpipdKbYa4k3ng= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; b=N6+/ZBvLwC8w7HOPbLdxJszi+YPGY0PS/wLiZMx0bNMsa1Df6G1K/NWfnAlFWE2O4w w90YtP/uBAaXIz5W2BndckHoGDKyn6wzMRKUgqUSKTHC4JVIpdVxUmjUVITcMkelC6FD wFrqE3TEwa5wEBwZjKsV5EqIHtw7fjQK0aQDk= Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.14.136.81 with SMTP id v57mr224067eei.55.1302780454956; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 04:27:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.14.37.134 with HTTP; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 04:27:34 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <20110414132116.3315a767@test> References: <20110413181538.GA2894@linux1> <1862409.dc8aBZ6kWJ@ugly-elf> <20110414132116.3315a767@test> Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2011 07:27:34 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] openrc portage news item From: Sylvain Alain To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=20cf303b3cc33cecea04a0df36d8 X-Archives-Salt: X-Archives-Hash: 3fe7b5db033dc0b492060e90b3055223 --20cf303b3cc33cecea04a0df36d8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable 2011/4/14 Thomas Beierlein > On Thu, 14 Apr 2011 12:51:55 +0200 > Tom=C3=A1? Chv=C3=A1tal wrote: > > > On Thursday 14 of April 2011 13:32:04 Kfir Lavi wrote: > > > When i run world update, I usually don't really check all the > > > written stuff. > > > > > > If I do this, I'm sure a lot more Gentoo users do the same. > > > So do expect people rebooting the machine without checking what > > > your have wrote. > > > This can be a major headache if you have few systems that are doing > > > auto updates. > > > I would solve this issue by stopping the emerge and getting the > > > attention of the user. > > > If I don't get the attention of the user, no openrc will be > > > installed. It should be something like emerge -C ... 1 .2 3 4 5... > > > > > > To conclude, you can't issue such a change without proper > > > confirmation from the user. > > > > > This was discussed multiple times, news items are to be read. > > Users ignore elog informations/web announcements/... so it was agreed > > that news item is agressive enough to user so they must read it. > > If they don't do so it is just their fault. > > And no runtime changing for portage where it expect some input is > > seriously stupid idea, most of us script updates in batch and noone > > would actualy read it. > > > > Never the less as I said we expect user to read that stuff and if he > > does not he is on his own due to his dumb approach. > > Maybe we should underline our intention by having that policy > documented in the installation handbook. A good place may be section 2 > "Working with > Gentoo" (http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/handbook/handbook-x86.xml?part=3D2)= . > > At least all newbies will stumble upon it once. > > Regards, > Thomas. > Yeah, before the stabilization of OpenRc and Baselayout 2.x, the Gentoo handbook really need to be updated too. I don't see how a newbie should be able to install his box with an outdated handbook. --=20 Salut alp Sylvain --20cf303b3cc33cecea04a0df36d8 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

2011/4/14 Thomas Beierlein <tomjbe@gentoo.org>
On Thu, 14 Apr 2011 12:51:55 +0200
Tom=C3=A1? Chv=C3=A1tal <scarabe= us@gentoo.org> wrote:

> On Thursday 14 of April 2011 13:32:04 Kfir Lavi wrote:
> > When i run world update, I usually don't really check all the=
> > written stuff.
> >
> > If I do this, I'm sure a lot more Gentoo users do the same. > > So do expect people rebooting the machine without checking what > > your have wrote.
> > This can be a major headache if you have few systems that are doi= ng
> > auto updates.
> > I would solve this issue by stopping the emerge and getting the > > attention of the user.
> > If I don't get the attention of the user, no openrc will be > > installed. It should be something like emerge -C ... 1 .2 3 4 5..= .
> >
> > To conclude, you can't issue such a change without proper
> > confirmation from the user.
> >
> This was discussed multiple times, news items are to be read.
> Users ignore elog informations/web announcements/... so it was agreed<= br> > that news item is agressive enough to user so they must read it.
> If they don't do so it is just their fault.
> And no runtime changing for portage where it expect some input is
> seriously stupid idea, most of us script updates in batch and noone > would actualy read it.
>
> Never the less as I said we expect user to read that stuff and if he > does not he is on his own due to his dumb approach.

Maybe we should underline our intention by having that policy documented in the installation handbook. A good place may be section 2
"Working with
Gentoo" (http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/handbook/hand= book-x86.xml?part=3D2).

At least all newbies will stumble upon it once.

Regards,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Thomas.

Yeah, before the stabilization of OpenRc and = Baselayout 2.x, the Gentoo handbook really need to be updated too.

= I don't see how a newbie should be able to install his box with an outd= ated handbook.

--
Salut
alp
Sylvain

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