From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8E4E0158089 for ; Tue, 12 Sep 2023 15:01:47 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 5AF492BC029; Tue, 12 Sep 2023 15:01:44 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp.gentoo.org (smtp.gentoo.org [IPv6:2001:470:ea4a:1:5054:ff:fec7:86e4]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2685B2BC013 for ; Tue, 12 Sep 2023 15:01:44 +0000 (UTC) References: <7802203.lOV4Wx5bFT@kona> <20230911082243.65aa85f5@Akita> <4128737.ElGaqSPkdT@kona> <20230911084231.73dd619f@Akita> <5848191c-8708-edfe-0c69-eeced3907b0d@gmail.com> <87zg1szc23.fsf@gentoo.org> <5d96d41de2f7057b42b436783678c8c4.squirrel@ukinbox.ecrypt.net> <87zg1sxu88.fsf@gentoo.org> <6aca04641c105c3fc72910fdbb7b6c01.squirrel@ukinbox.ecrypt.net> <877cowxs1c.fsf@gentoo.org> <92dfbb91650e4fe9c82268ccddf8b0ab.squirrel@ukinbox.ecrypt.net> User-agent: mu4e 1.10.6; emacs 30.0.50 From: Sam James To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] last rites: sys-fs/eudev Date: Tue, 12 Sep 2023 16:00:15 +0100 Organization: Gentoo In-reply-to: <92dfbb91650e4fe9c82268ccddf8b0ab.squirrel@ukinbox.ecrypt.net> Message-ID: <87edj3wi3v.fsf@gentoo.org> Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org X-Auto-Response-Suppress: DR, RN, NRN, OOF, AutoReply MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Archives-Salt: 7bf19272-89a7-41c9-a41c-b398649cb239 X-Archives-Hash: a2e7d7bfb2e07161bbcc89671fb9c125 "Eddie Chapman" writes: > Rich Freeman wrote: >> On Tue, Sep 12, 2023 at 9:36=E2=80=AFAM Eddie Chapman w= rote: >> >>> in Gentoo. Have any of these 4 maintainers publicly said (anywhere) >>> that they are not interested in being maintainers anymore (which is fine >>> if that is the case)? We're not talking here about a lone maintainer of >>> some peripheral package that's disappeared leaving an orphaned package. >> >> It isn't like somebody is censoring the lists or waging commit wars on >> the metadata.xml/mask file. If somebody was eager to maintain it I'm su= re >> they'd have spoken up. >> >>> I'm an outsider to Gentoo development (just a heavy user for over a >>> decade both personally and professionally) so I might have missed >>> something. I just find it puzzling. >> >> I'm not puzzled by what is going on, or by your email, because it >> happens basically anytime a high-profile package is treecleaned. Yes, >> Gentoo is about choice, but somebody has to actually do work to make >> the choices viable. There are always more people interested in using >> software than maintaining it. The frustration is completely >> understandable, but also kinda unavoidable. > > It starts to bother me that so many people straight away assume that when > someone questions things it's because they are a frustrated user who just > wants everyone else to do the work for them. And the same old argument > keeps being repeated over and over again *as if they think that no one > gets it* apart from us devs. I've been a free & oss software user for over > 20 years and I find it very patronising whenever it happens. The reality > is that are very few people in this community that don't understand the > fundamentals of free software, that no one is being paid, no one is > obligated, we are all volunteers, well then why don't you do it, etc, etc. > I've never asked or expected anyone to actually step up and do the work > and if you read my messages you will see that I've never even implied it. > No, but other people in the thread have, and the expectation is others will read it too. This is one of those topics where in particular we get a lot of it. Suggestions of "something smelly" then do imply some of the things you're saying. We're used to conspiratorial suggestions with this topic too. >> Repo QA standards don't mean that it has to barely work for your >> specific use case. The package has to deal with compatibility issues wi= th >> stuff you don't use as well, which is why maintaining a system package c= an >> be hard work. It is usually less of an issue for more ordinary >> applications, which tend to have fewer interactions. If it is "good >> enough" for you as it is, then just move it to a private overlay and keep >> using it. You probably would need to override a virtual or two as well. >> Or publish your work somewhere others can use >> it. > > I see, so again I just don't get it do I? I'm just a user who is in their > own little world and all they care about is what works for them, and I > don't think or understand anything about the bigger picture. I wouldn't read that much into it. Rich is always verbose (and I mean no insult there), he's just being explicit about the options. > >> -- >> Rich