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([2a02:278:41a0:64d:e27:c13b:1813:e742]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id z7-20020a7bc7c7000000b00402bda974ddsm5348043wmk.6.2023.09.15.11.38.29 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 15 Sep 2023 11:38:29 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <7350aefa-e828-a831-b0bd-15b4bb30df02@asokolov.org> Date: Fri, 15 Sep 2023 19:38:27 +0100 Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org X-Auto-Response-Suppress: DR, RN, NRN, OOF, AutoReply MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:102.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/102.15.0 Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] last rites: sys-fs/eudev To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org References: <7802203.lOV4Wx5bFT@kona> <92dfbb91650e4fe9c82268ccddf8b0ab.squirrel@ukinbox.ecrypt.net> <4270953.Sgy9Pd6rRy@pinacolada> <25616924cf66471fbd1075753551dffa.squirrel@ukinbox.ecrypt.net> <7B549F95-5EEA-4DD3-A046-AA6F2C7B6349@gentoo.org> <5aa46e8fd2c09e8d54c6a9ec71725529.squirrel@ukinbox.ecrypt.net> <6e35ba9b-a55b-4b36-9d79-96faa5fb1dc6@gentoo.org> <0daf33d92cd33094b88c0411a16a63ac.squirrel@ukinbox.ecrypt.net> <50d2d8a5796c8f71b58747d3f23593dd.squirrel@ukinbox.ecrypt.net> <86ttrws520.fsf@gentoo.org> <20230915081018.7b231b78@Akita> Content-Language: en-GB From: Alexey Sokolov In-Reply-To: <20230915081018.7b231b78@Akita> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Archives-Salt: 55cc3ae8-0576-4bad-82c1-e0258d25a71a X-Archives-Hash: f68759fb41b472d5807051ad8b5c3d55 15.09.2023 16:10, orbea пишет: > On Fri, 15 Sep 2023 01:19:22 +0200 > Arsen Arsenović wrote: > >> "Eddie Chapman" writes: >> >>> Not aiming this at you personally but this argument has been made >>> more than once in this thread and I personally don't think it >>> carries any weight, because it can be levelled at anyone who raises >>> an issue about anything. If you don't like it, then just go and >>> roll your own. >> >> ::gentoo is supposed to be a coherent set of packages provided by >> Gentoo developers, with a reasonable scope. eudev no longer fits >> into the 'coherent' part of that definition, and there are zero >> advantages to it over systemd-utils[udev]. >> >> The _only_ difference between a sys-fs/eudev::eudev and >> sys-fs/eudev::gentoo package that would exist if the former were to be >> made into an overlay is that Gentoo developers would be responsible >> for the latter. There are no Gentoo developers interested in being >> responsible for the latter (AFAIK), and there is no tangible benefit >> to the latter for any Gentoo developer to latch onto. >> >> Seeing as there is at least half a dozen people seemingly interested >> in maintaining eudev, why not just form an overlay? This way, >> virtual/{,lib}udev doesn't get polluted with implementations which >> don't fullfil the definition of a virtual provider in ::gentoo, nor >> with use-flag hacks, but users which wish to use eudev still have >> access to it, and upstream eudev gets half a dozen potential >> contributors, which are needed, _badly_. At risk of repeating >> myself, I'd like to point out again that the only viable approach for >> eudev upstream to take is to re-fork systemd and find a viable way to >> stay up-to-date, while fixing up incompatibilities with musl. I've >> made proposals a few years ago and restated them in this thread. > > What incompatibilities with musl? I am using musl-1.2.4 with eudev and > there do not seem to be any issues in that regard. > > I also don't see any musl specific issues reported upstream or for > Gentoo. Am I missing something? Arsen meant incompatibilities of systemd-udev, not of eudev [1]. No idea what's the current state of udev upstream is though. Alpine uses musl, that's one of reasons why they are interested in eudev. [1] See https://gitweb.gentoo.org/proj/eudev.git/commit/?id=f559dc96f4105f605272defac9276ef9cb6f5dc6 > >> >>> Of course I know I (and anyone else) can do that. So then what's the >>> point of discussing anything then? >> >> Just because an argument is widely applicable does not make it >> invalid. >> >> Note that this argument is seldom the first resort, since, as you >> note, it's not overly productive. Indeed, it was not the first >> resort here. sys-fs/eudev has long overstayed the original removal >> plan. >> >>> What's the point of having a big tree with hundreds of packages? Why >>> not have a very minimal tree instead and let everyone go and run >>> multiple independent repos so we can all do what we want? Then we >>> wouldn't have any discussion about what to include and what not. In >>> fact maybe that's not a bad idea. >> >> I'm not sure how to fit this within the context of the thread. >> >> Have a lovely evening. > > -- Best regards, Alexey "DarthGandalf" Sokolov