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From: hasufell <hasufell@gentoo.org>
To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org
Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] don't rely on dynamic deps
Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2014 20:28:24 +0000	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <53CD77E8.705@gentoo.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <53CD6D1F.3030609@gentoo.org>

Samuli Suominen:
> So, -1, useless rebuilds is one of the biggest problems lately

I am not sure if that is a joke.

We have:
* a broken PM which does incomplete dep calculation, gives wrong
suggestions to the user, has totally useless error/debug output,
randomly fails to remove files, allows to break your system in numerous
ways and whatnot... and I'm not going through bugzilla now to prove it
* overcomplex eclasses, because people try to avoid getting stuff into
the PM, resulting in more confusion for the PM
* repeatedly broken stable packages
* people coding against a PM instead of PMS and thus relying on
undocumented behavior and breaking the "meta-distribution" part of gentoo
* a PM codebase no one wants to be involved in

and you tell me the biggest problems are useless rebuilds?

Reality check, please. (btw... I didn't come up with the subslot idea,
so maybe check with those guys about useless rebuilds)


Removing dynamic deps is an easy way to improve the strictness of
portage, adhere better to PMS and improve compatibility with other PMs.

After that, we can discuss if there is a _sane_ way to avoid such rebuilds.


  parent reply	other threads:[~2014-07-21 20:28 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 276+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2014-07-21 19:37 [gentoo-dev] don't rely on dynamic deps hasufell
2014-07-21 19:42 ` Samuli Suominen
2014-07-21 19:50   ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-21 20:06     ` Samuli Suominen
2014-07-21 20:13       ` Ian Stakenvicius
2014-07-21 20:12         ` Samuli Suominen
2014-07-21 20:17       ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-21 20:28   ` hasufell [this message]
2014-07-21 20:41     ` Ian Stakenvicius
2014-07-22 22:05       ` Tom Wijsman
2014-08-27 16:18         ` Jan Matejka
2014-07-21 20:49     ` Michał Górny
2014-07-21 21:01     ` Jeroen Roovers
2014-07-21 21:06       ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-21 21:13         ` Jeroen Roovers
2014-07-21 21:16           ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-22 22:13       ` Tom Wijsman
2014-07-22 21:11   ` Michał Górny
2014-07-22 22:22     ` Tom Wijsman
2014-07-23 13:36     ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-22 21:56   ` Tom Wijsman
2014-07-25  8:36     ` Pacho Ramos
2014-07-26 12:00     ` [gentoo-dev] " Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 13:33       ` Pacho Ramos
2014-07-21 19:53 ` [gentoo-dev] " Andreas K. Huettel
2014-07-21 19:55   ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-21 21:06     ` Pacho Ramos
2014-07-21 21:15       ` Jeroen Roovers
2014-07-21 21:21         ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-21 21:25           ` Michał Górny
2014-07-21 21:30             ` Maxim Kammerer
2014-07-26 12:52               ` [gentoo-dev] " Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 12:54           ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 13:00             ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-26 14:57               ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 15:04                 ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-22  7:39       ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-22  7:52         ` Pacho Ramos
2014-07-22  9:50         ` Alexander Berntsen
2014-07-22 13:53       ` [gentoo-dev] " Ian Stakenvicius
2014-07-22 18:40         ` [gentoo-dev] " Martin Vaeth
2014-07-22 18:50           ` Alexander Berntsen
2014-07-23  4:11             ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-22 18:51           ` Ulrich Mueller
2014-07-22 19:10             ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-22 19:26               ` Ulrich Mueller
2014-07-22 20:06                 ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-22 20:40                   ` Ulrich Mueller
2014-07-22 20:51                     ` Andreas K. Huettel
2014-07-23 13:15                       ` Ian Stakenvicius
2014-07-26 11:20                         ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-23  1:15                   ` Rich Freeman
2014-07-25  8:38                     ` Duncan
2014-07-26 11:31                     ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-22 22:44         ` [gentoo-dev] " Tom Wijsman
2014-07-23  0:01           ` Ian Stakenvicius
2014-07-24 22:42             ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-26 13:00               ` [gentoo-dev] " Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 13:07                 ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-25 14:44           ` [gentoo-dev] " Ian Stakenvicius
2014-07-25 14:59             ` Ian Stakenvicius
2014-07-25 15:09             ` hasufell
2014-07-25 15:15               ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-25 15:23                 ` hasufell
2014-07-25 15:26                   ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-25 15:44                     ` hasufell
2014-07-26  7:14                       ` [gentoo-dev] " Duncan
2014-07-26 12:41               ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 12:49                 ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-26 15:04                   ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 15:09                     ` hasufell
2014-07-26 15:12                     ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-27 11:42                   ` Samuli Suominen
2014-07-27 11:50                     ` hasufell
2014-07-27 12:01                       ` [gentoo-dev] Behaving productively on the list Andreas K. Huettel
2014-07-27 12:04                         ` hasufell
2014-07-27 12:07                           ` Andreas K. Huettel
2014-07-27 12:26                             ` hasufell
2014-07-27 12:06                       ` [gentoo-dev] Re: don't rely on dynamic deps Samuli Suominen
2014-07-27 12:31                         ` hasufell
2014-07-27 13:11                           ` Rich Freeman
2014-07-27 11:54                     ` "Paweł Hajdan, Jr."
2014-07-27 11:57                       ` hasufell
2014-07-27 13:20                     ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-27 13:47                     ` Michał Górny
2014-07-28  6:35                       ` Samuli Suominen
2014-07-30  4:45                     ` Alexander Tsoy
2014-07-30  5:36                       ` Samuli Suominen
2014-07-30  7:22                         ` Peter Stuge
2014-07-30  7:38                         ` "Paweł Hajdan, Jr."
2014-07-30 11:18                           ` Rich Freeman
2014-07-30 11:23                             ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-30 12:38                             ` Samuli Suominen
2014-08-12 21:32                               ` Tom Wijsman
2014-07-26 12:56                 ` Ulrich Mueller
2014-08-01 21:38                   ` [gentoo-dev] PMS (was: don't rely on dynamic deps) Martin Vaeth
2014-08-02  5:19                     ` [gentoo-dev] PMS Ulrich Mueller
2014-08-02  9:30                       ` [gentoo-dev] PMS Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 12:08           ` [gentoo-dev] don't rely on dynamic deps Ulrich Mueller
2014-07-23 13:33       ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-25  1:45         ` Rich Freeman
2014-07-25 15:01           ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-25 15:53             ` Alexander Berntsen
2014-07-25 18:26             ` Rich Freeman
2014-07-26 13:29             ` [gentoo-dev] " Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 13:20           ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-25  8:53         ` [gentoo-dev] " Pacho Ramos
2014-07-26 13:36           ` [gentoo-dev] " Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 12:32         ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 12:44           ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-26 13:16             ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 13:20               ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-26 14:46                 ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 14:53                   ` hasufell
2014-07-26 14:54                   ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-26 15:11                     ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 15:22                       ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-26 15:40                         ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 15:51                           ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-28 14:30                         ` Ian Stakenvicius
2014-07-28 14:43                           ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-28 15:38                             ` Ian Stakenvicius
2014-07-28 19:31                               ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-24 22:06       ` [gentoo-dev] " Michał Górny
2014-07-25  8:51         ` Pacho Ramos
2014-07-25 17:15         ` Andreas K. Huettel
2014-07-25 17:36           ` Ian Stakenvicius
2014-07-25 17:39             ` Ian Stakenvicius
2014-07-26 17:47             ` Taahir Ahmed
2014-07-26 18:21               ` Taahir Ahmed
2014-07-26 13:41         ` [gentoo-dev] " Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 13:46           ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-26 15:01             ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 15:09               ` Michał Górny
2014-07-26 15:14                 ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-21 20:56   ` [gentoo-dev] " Michał Górny
2014-07-21 21:13     ` Samuli Suominen
2014-07-21 21:22       ` Michał Górny
2014-07-21 22:52       ` William Hubbs
2014-07-22  0:36         ` hasufell
2014-07-22  9:42           ` Alexander Berntsen
2014-07-22 19:42             ` William Hubbs
2014-07-22  1:05         ` Rick "Zero_Chaos" Farina
2014-07-22  5:10           ` Samuli Suominen
2014-07-22 23:06             ` Tom Wijsman
2014-07-26  4:36               ` Patrick Lauer
2014-07-26 13:55                 ` [gentoo-dev] binpkg (was: don't rely on dynamic deps) Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 19:18                 ` [gentoo-dev] don't rely on dynamic deps Tom Wijsman
2014-07-22 22:52         ` Tom Wijsman
2014-07-22  1:34     ` Alexandre Rostovtsev
2014-07-22 23:13       ` Tom Wijsman
2014-07-23  2:05         ` Alexandre Rostovtsev
2014-07-26 14:02           ` [gentoo-dev] " Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 14:29             ` Michał Górny
2014-07-26 15:18               ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-25  7:34       ` [gentoo-dev] " Michał Górny
2014-07-22 22:29   ` Tom Wijsman
2014-07-21 21:52 ` Alexander Berntsen
2014-07-22  7:25   ` "Paweł Hajdan, Jr."
2014-07-22 18:44     ` Kent Fredric
2014-07-22 18:50       ` Alexander Berntsen
2014-07-22 23:28         ` Tom Wijsman
2014-07-23  8:53       ` [gentoo-dev] " Duncan
2014-07-26 14:12       ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 22:43         ` Kent Fredric
2014-07-27  7:16           ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-27 10:16             ` [gentoo-dev] Avoiding rebuilds (was: don't rely on dynamic deps) Ulrich Mueller
2014-07-27 12:19               ` Rich Freeman
2014-07-27 13:45               ` [gentoo-dev] Avoiding rebuilds hasufell
2014-07-28  5:49                 ` [gentoo-dev] " Martin Vaeth
2014-07-28 15:15                   ` Brian Dolbec
2014-08-01  9:35                   ` Steven J. Long
2014-08-01 20:49                     ` Martin Vaeth
2014-08-02 13:19                       ` Steven J. Long
2014-08-03 15:14                         ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-27 10:43             ` [gentoo-dev] Re: don't rely on dynamic deps Kent Fredric
2014-07-27 12:04               ` Rich Freeman
2014-07-27 21:46                 ` Rich Freeman
2014-07-27 21:57                   ` Kent Fredric
2014-07-28 18:27                 ` Ian Stakenvicius
2014-07-28 18:35                   ` Rich Freeman
2014-07-22 19:05     ` [gentoo-dev] " Samuli Suominen
2014-07-22 23:32       ` Tom Wijsman
2014-07-23  1:21       ` hasufell
2014-07-23 13:34       ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-22 19:26     ` Michał Górny
2014-07-22 23:21     ` Tom Wijsman
2014-07-26 12:19       ` [gentoo-dev] " Martin Vaeth
2014-07-22  8:21   ` Michael Palimaka
2014-07-22  8:32     ` Kristian Fiskerstrand
2014-07-22  9:25       ` Pacho Ramos
2014-07-22 17:03         ` Sven Vermeulen
2014-07-22 17:11           ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-22 17:32             ` Samuli Suominen
2014-07-22  8:33     ` Samuli Suominen
2014-07-22 23:36     ` Tom Wijsman
2014-07-23 12:14       ` Michael Palimaka
2014-07-25 21:59         ` Tom Wijsman
2014-07-26 17:12           ` Michael Palimaka
2014-07-26 19:21             ` Tom Wijsman
2014-07-26 19:30               ` Michael Palimaka
2014-08-12 21:49                 ` Tom Wijsman
2014-07-26 14:25       ` Martin Vaeth
2014-08-12 22:11         ` Tom Wijsman
2014-07-22 11:58   ` [gentoo-dev] " hasufell
2014-07-26 14:09   ` [gentoo-dev] " Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 14:22     ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-26 14:33       ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 14:36         ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-26 14:40           ` hasufell
2014-07-27  7:46             ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 14:32     ` Michał Górny
2014-07-26 15:27       ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 15:29         ` hasufell
2014-07-26 16:10           ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 15:35         ` Michał Górny
2014-07-26 15:59           ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 16:02             ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-26 16:36               ` Rich Freeman
2014-07-26 16:45                 ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-26 15:39         ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-26 16:05           ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 16:14             ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-26 16:28               ` Rich Freeman
2014-07-26 16:34                 ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-26 18:36               ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-26 18:42                 ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-27 16:27                   ` Peter Stuge
2014-07-27 14:05   ` [gentoo-dev] " "Paweł Hajdan, Jr."
2014-07-27 14:42     ` Rich Freeman
2014-07-27 14:56       ` "Paweł Hajdan, Jr."
2014-07-27 14:59         ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-27 15:09           ` Rich Freeman
2014-07-27 15:16             ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-27 17:02               ` Peter Stuge
2014-07-27 17:11                 ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-27 17:16                   ` Peter Stuge
2014-07-27 17:24                     ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-28  6:59         ` [gentoo-dev] " Duncan
2014-07-28  8:26           ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-28  9:28             ` Peter Stuge
2014-07-28 13:12               ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-28 13:29                 ` Peter Stuge
2014-07-28 18:50                   ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-28 18:57                     ` Rich Freeman
2014-07-29  7:33                       ` Peter Stuge
2014-07-29  9:12                         ` Kent Fredric
2014-07-29 10:20                         ` Martin Vaeth
2014-07-29 10:47                         ` Rich Freeman
2014-07-27 15:44       ` [gentoo-dev] " Kent Fredric
2014-07-27 15:52         ` Rich Freeman
2014-07-27 16:05           ` Kent Fredric
2014-07-28  4:43             ` [gentoo-dev] " Martin Vaeth
2014-07-27 20:24       ` [gentoo-dev] " Michał Górny
2014-07-27 20:51         ` Peter Stuge
2014-07-27 20:56           ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-27 21:27             ` Kent Fredric
2014-07-27 21:34               ` Rich Freeman
2014-07-27 21:50                 ` Kent Fredric
2014-07-27 21:54                   ` Rich Freeman
2014-07-27 21:14           ` Michał Górny
2014-07-27 21:08         ` Rich Freeman
2014-07-27 21:17           ` Michał Górny
2014-07-27 21:26             ` Rich Freeman
2014-07-27 21:33               ` Ciaran McCreesh
2014-07-27 21:39                 ` Rich Freeman
2014-07-28  5:21                   ` [gentoo-dev] " Martin Vaeth
2014-07-27 22:06                 ` [gentoo-dev] " Arfrever Frehtes Taifersar Arahesis
2014-07-28 16:29           ` Ian Stakenvicius
2014-07-28 16:44             ` Rich Freeman
2014-07-28  5:06         ` [gentoo-dev] " Martin Vaeth
2014-07-27 14:42     ` [gentoo-dev] " Michał Górny
2014-07-22 21:47 ` Tom Wijsman
2014-07-25  5:44   ` [gentoo-dev] " Duncan
2014-07-25 22:09     ` Tom Wijsman
2014-07-26  5:21       ` Duncan

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