From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC83713877A for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2014 15:02:36 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 17EDFE0B5D; Tue, 17 Jun 2014 15:02:32 +0000 (UTC) Received: from qmta14.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta14.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [76.96.59.212]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21281E0AAE for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2014 15:02:31 +0000 (UTC) Received: from omta20.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.71]) by qmta14.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id FPXg1o0031YDfWL5ET2WRG; Tue, 17 Jun 2014 15:02:30 +0000 Received: from [192.168.1.13] ([50.190.84.14]) by omta20.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id FT2W1o00Y0JZ7Re3gT2Wmd; Tue, 17 Jun 2014 15:02:30 +0000 Message-ID: <53A0587F.8000408@gentoo.org> Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2014 11:02:23 -0400 From: Joshua Kinard User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.6.0 Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Re: Re: crossdev and multilib interference References: <53208139.2040509@gentoo.org> <1660834.UE1ARX9orZ@vapier> <20140327084108.GA3654@rathaus.eclipse.co.uk> <31757180.gTPZtqku3h@vapier> <20140330095348.GA18419@rathaus.eclipse.co.uk> <539E03A9.3010109@gentoo.org> <539E0563.3080302@gentoo.org> <539EF323.7020208@gentoo.org> <1402944163.8309.2.camel@oswin.hackershack.net> <539F462E.6050905@gentoo.org> <20140616214257.096c93fc@marga.jer-c2.orkz.net> <539F49C2.6090008@gentoo.org> <539F4DFA.7020706@gentoo.org> <539F5288.1000000@gentoo.org> <539F5AB5.7000006@gentoo.org> <539F6B3C.7030807@gentoo.org> <539F8000.5080804@gentoo.org> <539F9E41.9050505@gentoo.org> <539FA536.3010401@gentoo.org> <53A034F4.2000900@gentoo.org> <53A04AF6.9010106@gentoo.org> <53A052EE.4020702@gentoo.org> In-Reply-To: <53A052EE.4020702@gentoo.org> X-Enigmail-Version: 1.6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=comcast.net; s=q20140121; t=1403017350; bh=OdiRTJ64flphLaG0YnUyq7ukLDFnzVCiLf9Sh4fvlsc=; h=Received:Received:Message-ID:Date:From:MIME-Version:To:Subject: Content-Type; b=q+BKRk/Tf+U4Fv/LLxnr9emUM4L6b84LcnYTek7WJLCiP6mdecGesKLBr+O/zxyT1 KGxepmovaDVirVkmDfCsz6vZNVcLLDE2b3XGn/hUgl5JjqZQapAjoUF1TNO0NO2D28 gwO+6ChiXD3V5X9l1RVXk4GGURvoBCXaH/bUuj82kRG5WCHast890lW0m1PU2cUghU 9mihGizvPPYhROhuWbNEK0SF6Kq0TOYCAPWBVPRgbbDAIB8aouqL1lOesH/ZpiTHUA xyLw8UPNn2SYeXWrH3izJmtIToR+hhkHUM/nAxeeM9JfBDF9VULV6mCLlf9g8AIf5m y9RtpZCU6Endw== X-Archives-Salt: c178702f-57db-4f25-a050-7764f7cd7bd7 X-Archives-Hash: 93acd011c1b39a172af1b89eeb7e2068 On 06/17/2014 10:38, hasufell wrote: > Joshua Kinard: >> >> "upstream" didn't say anywhere in that bug that they weren't interested. >> They countered your reasoning with a technical argument. QA even states >> that you need to file separate bugs for the various build failures. You >> could set up a master TRACKER bug for these crossdev-related issues, and >> then link in any existing bugs or create new ones tied to it, and that way, >> you have things documented. >> > > I appreciate that you want to help, but I'm not sure how many times I > have to explain to you that the PATH idea was neglected by the embedded > gentoo project lead. Check the history of this thread, it starts here: > https://groups.google.com/d/msg/linux.gentoo.dev/KZykx1DAJyM/YCMVUt4CzjUJ I already have that thread in my client, so let me quote a few choice bits: On 03/26/2014 01:17, Mike Frysinger wrote: >> when you run `crossdev i686-pc-linux-gnu`, it owns that tuple. that includes >> i686-pc-linux-gnu-pkg-config. >> >> if we're going to have the multilib system lie and use a tuple that doesn't >> actually exist, we either: >> >> (1) override all the vars so they point back to the real toolchain. >> this doesn't scale when you consider helper tools like the legacy sdl-config >> or the extended set of tools that binutils/gcc/etc... install. it's mitigated >> by the fact the set of vars in play most of the time is low. >> >> (2) use tuples with loaded vendor fields to reduce the chance of collisions. >> e.g. having an ABI=amd64 system use i686-gentoo%multilib-linux-gnu instead of >> i686-pc-linux-gnu would defeat any automatic path searches. On 03/26/2014 22:41, Mike Frysinger wrote: >> >> as i pointed out elsewhere in this thread, the problem is that multilib relies >> on automatic detection of the toolchain *failing* so that it falls back to the >> native value. in other words, when you run `./configure --host=i686-pc-linux- >> gnu`, it tries to find e.g. i686-pc-linux-gnu-ar. it doesn't exist so the >> fallback is used (plain `ar`). multilib is using these tuples so that the >> standard checks (autoconf/eclasses/etc...) trigger in the right ways for the >> cpu/os/userland combinations. >> >> since crossdev installs a full proper toolchain for the target, the one >> multilib was using to lie now exists and its toolchain is used instead. On 03/27/2014 02:41, Mike Frysinger wrote: >> >> pkg-config does need fixing in some way. we already know this. it's why the >> multilib eclasses currently set PKG_CONFIG_XXX vars -- preciously so the >> correct ABI dir is utilized. and this breaks when using some build systems >> (like scons) where the env gets blown away (although we also know scons >> sucks). > So again, I am not doing work that goes diametral to what the project > lead wants and I am not going to fork crossdev. > > I have proposed numerous ways to communicate this problem to the user > without touching any of the precious toolchain/embedded packages. If no > one responds there, I'll just pick one and apply it. And what I am trying to tell you is that making hardmask threats don't solve the core problem. You're threatening to to start a mask/unmask war that probably won't end well for you. Mike has, in all of the messages I have in the thread, provided clear technical explanations for why crossdev operates the way it does, and that it isn't the source of these problems. Provide a technical counter-argument to that or propose a solution that people can agree on and you're going to find people are a LOT more willing to stand with you on fixing the perceived problem. -- Joshua Kinard Gentoo/MIPS kumba@gentoo.org 4096R/D25D95E3 2011-03-28 "The past tempts us, the present confuses us, the future frightens us. And our lives slip away, moment by moment, lost in that vast, terrible in-between." --Emperor Turhan, Centauri Republic