[gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[Alex Alexander]

Our bug queue has 100 bugs!

If you have some spare time, please help assign/sort a few bugs.

To view the bug queue, click here: http://bit.ly/m8PQS5

Thanks!

Re: [gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[Sergey Popov]

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31.10.2012 16:00, Alex Alexander wrote:
> Our bug queue has 100 bugs!
>
> If you have some spare time, please help assign/sort a few bugs.
>
> To view the bug queue, click here: http://bit.ly/m8PQS5
>
> Thanks!
>
Most of them from one user, who posted them using some kind of script. I
have wrangled some other bugs, which looks more 'hand made', cause i am
not sure about those ones.


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Re: [gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[Michał Górny]

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On Wed, 31 Oct 2012 16:20:43 +0400
Sergey Popov <pinkbyte@gentoo.org> wrote:

> 31.10.2012 16:00, Alex Alexander wrote:
> > Our bug queue has 100 bugs!
> >
> > If you have some spare time, please help assign/sort a few bugs.
> >
> > To view the bug queue, click here: http://bit.ly/m8PQS5
> >
> > Thanks!
> >
> Most of them from one user, who posted them using some kind of script. I
> have wrangled some other bugs, which looks more 'hand made', cause i am
> not sure about those ones.

Yes, they look similarly to Arfrever's 'check and consider improving'
bugs ;P.

-- 
Best regards,
Michał Górny

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Re: [gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[Dirkjan Ochtman]

That's rather unsurprising...

If you're going to file bugs "in a semi-automated manner", might as
well try to assign to the correct maintainer?

Cheers,

Dirkjan

On Wed, Oct 31, 2012 at 1:00 PM, Alex Alexander <wired@gentoo.org> wrote:
> Our bug queue has 100 bugs!
>
> If you have some spare time, please help assign/sort a few bugs.
>
> To view the bug queue, click here: http://bit.ly/m8PQS5
>
> Thanks!
>

Re: [gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[Dirkjan Ochtman]

Simply look at the metadata.xml files which can be found in each
package directory.

Though if you don't know these kinds of basics, I'm not sure you
should be doing *any* (semi- or not) automated bug filing.

Cheers,

Dirkjan

On Wed, Oct 31, 2012 at 1:34 PM, Marco Poletti <poletti.marco@gmail.com> wrote:
> On mer 31 ott 2012 13:31:53 CET, Dirkjan Ochtman wrote:
>> That's rather unsurprising...
>>
>> If you're going to file bugs "in a semi-automated manner", might as
>> well try to assign to the correct maintainer?
>
> Can you give me some help on how to do that?
> How can I find the maintainer of a package?
>
>
> Marco
>

Re: [gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[Dirkjan Ochtman]

The php herd is the maintainer, so you should php-bugs@gentoo.org (the
herd-to-email mapping can probably be found elsewhere).

Still, please get more of a feeling for how the Portage tree is put
together before doing more automated bug filing, please.

Cheers,

Dirkjan

On Wed, Oct 31, 2012 at 2:08 PM, Marco Poletti <poletti.marco@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 31/10/2012 13:49, Dirkjan Ochtman wrote:
>> Simply look at the metadata.xml files which can be found in each
>> package directory.
> I don't find any maintainer email there...
> For example:
>
>  ~ > cat /usr/portage/dev-lang/php/metadata.xml
> <?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?>
> <!DOCTYPE pkgmetadata SYSTEM "http://www.gentoo.org/dtd/metadata.dtd">
> <pkgmetadata>
>         <herd>php</herd>
>         <use>
>                 <flag name='cli'>Enable CLI SAPI</flag>
>                 <flag name='embed'>Enable embed SAPI</flag>
>                 <flag name='enchant'>Add supports Enchant spelling
> library.</flag>
>                 <flag name='fileinfo'>Add fileinfo extension support</flag>
>                 <flag name='filter'>Add filter extension support</flag>
>                 <flag name='fpm'>Enable the FastCGI Process Manager
> SAPI</flag>
>                 <flag name='gd'>Adds support for gd (bundled with
> PHP)</flag>
>                 <flag name='hash'>Enable the hash extension</flag>
>                 <flag name='json'>Enable JSON support</flag>
>                 <flag name='ldap-sasl'>Add SASL support for the PHP LDAP
> extension</flag>
>                 <flag name='mysqlnd'>Use native driver for mysql,
> mysqli, PDO_Mysql</flag>
>                 <flag name='intl'>Enables the intl extension for
> extended internalization support</flag>
>                 <flag name='pic'>Force shared modules to build as PIC on
> x86 (speed tradeoff with memory usage)</flag>
>                 <flag name='pdo'>Enable the bundled PDO extensions</flag>
>                 <flag name='phar'>Enables the phar extension to provide
> phar archive support</flag>
>                 <flag name='suhosin'>Add Suhosin support (patch and
> extension from http://www.suhosin.org/)</flag>
>                 <flag restrict="&gt;=dev-lang/php-5.3.6_rc1"
> name='suhosin'>Add the Suhosin patch  from http://www.suhosin.org/)</flag>
>                 <flag name='sqlite2'>Add sqlite2 support. Will be
> removed</flag>
>                 <flag name='xmlreader'>Enable XMLReader support</flag>
>                 <flag name='xmlwriter'>Enable XMLWriter support</flag>
>                 <flag name='zip'>Enable ZIP file support</flag>
>         </use>
> </pkgmetadata>
>
>
> Marco
>

Re: [gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[Jeroen Roovers]

On Wed, 31 Oct 2012 13:49:37 +0100
Dirkjan Ochtman <djc@gentoo.org> wrote:

> Though if you don't know these kinds of basics, I'm not sure you
> should be doing *any* (semi- or not) automated bug filing.

What if you don't have the privilege to assign bugs, but are willing to
do the work of filing the bugs?


     jer

Re: [gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[Dirkjan Ochtman]

On Wed, Oct 31, 2012 at 5:08 PM, Jeroen Roovers <jer@gentoo.org> wrote:
>> Though if you don't know these kinds of basics, I'm not sure you
>> should be doing *any* (semi- or not) automated bug filing.
>
> What if you don't have the privilege to assign bugs, but are willing to
> do the work of filing the bugs?

Yeah, that kind of sucks. Perhaps we should extend the privilege a
little more often?

Cheers,

Dirkjan

Re: [gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[Rick "Zero_Chaos" Farina]

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On 11/01/2012 03:59 AM, Dirkjan Ochtman wrote:
> On Wed, Oct 31, 2012 at 5:08 PM, Jeroen Roovers <jer@gentoo.org> wrote:
>>> Though if you don't know these kinds of basics, I'm not sure you
>>> should be doing *any* (semi- or not) automated bug filing.
>>
>> What if you don't have the privilege to assign bugs, but are willing to
>> do the work of filing the bugs?
> 
> Yeah, that kind of sucks. Perhaps we should extend the privilege a
> little more often?

I agree 100%, if anyone is willing to file proper and correct bugs in an
automated way then we need to extend to them the ability to properly
assign them to prevent our bug-wranglers from being crushed.  I believe
that allowing someone to assign a bug is very appropriate in this case.

- -Zero_Chaos
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Dirkjan
> 
> 

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Re: [gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[Markos Chandras]

On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 7:59 AM, Dirkjan Ochtman <djc@gentoo.org> wrote:
> On Wed, Oct 31, 2012 at 5:08 PM, Jeroen Roovers <jer@gentoo.org> wrote:
>>> Though if you don't know these kinds of basics, I'm not sure you
>>> should be doing *any* (semi- or not) automated bug filing.
>>
>> What if you don't have the privilege to assign bugs, but are willing to
>> do the work of filing the bugs?
>
> Yeah, that kind of sucks. Perhaps we should extend the privilege a
> little more often?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Dirkjan
>

Extend it? More often? It is not a matter of frequency. If a user
requests bugzilla rights, and a developer trusts him,
he can grant him access.

-- 
Regards,
Markos Chandras / Gentoo Linux Developer / Key ID: B4AFF2C2

Re: [gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[Jeroen Roovers]

On Thu, 1 Nov 2012 08:59:09 +0100
Dirkjan Ochtman <djc@gentoo.org> wrote:

> > What if you don't have the privilege to assign bugs, but are
> > willing to do the work of filing the bugs?
> 
> Yeah, that kind of sucks. Perhaps we should extend the privilege a
> little more often?

In this case no prior history helped me and I foresaw only a few bug
reports arising, not several dozens. And anyway, assigning them took
only half an hour.


     jer

Re: [gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[Tomáš Chvátal]

2012/10/31 Dirkjan Ochtman <djc@gentoo.org>:
> That's rather unsurprising...
>
> If you're going to file bugs "in a semi-automated manner", might as
> well try to assign to the correct maintainer?
>
Yep he should've assign them, but anyway the annoying elog messages
are an issue. And quite few packages suffer from it :-)

Tom

Re: [gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[Chris Reffett]

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On 10/31/2012 08:52 AM, Tomáš Chvátal wrote:
> 2012/10/31 Dirkjan Ochtman <djc@gentoo.org>:
>> That's rather unsurprising...
>> 
>> If you're going to file bugs "in a semi-automated manner", might
>> as well try to assign to the correct maintainer?
>> 
> Yep he should've assign them, but anyway the annoying elog
> messages are an issue. And quite few packages suffer from it :-)
> 
> Tom
> 
I disagree on most of them (and have marked the KDE-related bugs as
WONTFIX appropriately). Messages that tell the user about config
options, or "for x functionality install y" (at least until we get
SDEPEND or something similar added to portage) should show up every
time in my opinion. Only initial config and "you just enabled (flag)"
really merits this. Basically, I would rather the user get too many
elog messages than not enough, since I feel that a lot of people skip
over them anyway and so the "only display once" method makes it far
too easy for important messages to get lost in the shuffle.
Chris Reffett
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Re: [gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[Amadeusz Żołnowski]

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Quoting Chris Reffett (2012-10-31 16:17:20)
> > Yep he should've assign them, but anyway the annoying elog messages
> > are an issue. And quite few packages suffer from it :-)

It would actually be hard to find useful message which place is in elog
showing up every install.  Why not move such thing on Wiki for example?


> I disagree on most of them (and have marked the KDE-related bugs as
> WONTFIX appropriately). Messages that tell the user about config
> options,

...are *really* annoying, especially when you read it 100th time and
especially the one from kdelibs: "Your homedir is set to
\${HOME}/.kde4".


> or "for x functionality install y" (at least until we get
> SDEPEND or something similar added to portage) should show up every
> time in my opinion.

elog message for optional dependencies could be unified if must be
shown every time.


> Only initial config and "you just enabled (flag)" really merits this.
> Basically, I would rather the user get too many elog messages than not

If you assume that users time have no value and we can flood them with
meaningless messages.


> enough, since I feel that a lot of people skip over them anyway and so
> the "only display once" method makes it far too easy for important
> messages to get lost in the shuffle.

If user gets hundreds of such useless messages it is almost sure that
he/she will miss few hidden important messages.  The example could be
udev long elog message which ONE time has had hidden very important
message which I have unfortunately missed and ended up with unbootable
system.  In current form these messages have no use.

I have already highlighted this problem on mailing list:

Subject: [gentoo-dev] Useless messages (elog, ewarn, etc) in ebuilds
Id: 20120821132457.4319.78667@localhost


-- 
Amadeusz Żołnowski

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Re: [gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[Ben de Groot]

On 31 October 2012 23:17, Chris Reffett <creffett@gentoo.org> wrote:
> Basically, I would rather the user get too many
> elog messages than not enough, since I feel that a lot of people skip
> over them anyway and so the "only display once" method makes it far
> too easy for important messages to get lost in the shuffle.

Did you ever consider *why* so many users skip over elog messages?
Don't you think that could be because most of these messages of
useless to them, or they have already seem them many times?

I think we need to come up with a better policy regarding elog
messages, which would improve the signal to noise ratio.

-- 
Cheers,

Ben | yngwin
Gentoo developer
Gentoo Qt project lead, Gentoo Wiki admin

Re: [gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[Jauhien Piatlicki]

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03.11.12 09:04, Ben de Groot написав(ла):
> On 31 October 2012 23:17, Chris Reffett <creffett@gentoo.org> wrote:
>> Basically, I would rather the user get too many
>> elog messages than not enough, since I feel that a lot of people skip
>> over them anyway and so the "only display once" method makes it far
>> too easy for important messages to get lost in the shuffle.
> 
> Did you ever consider *why* so many users skip over elog messages?
> Don't you think that could be because most of these messages of
> useless to them, or they have already seem them many times?
> 
> I think we need to come up with a better policy regarding elog
> messages, which would improve the signal to noise ratio.
> 

Yes, it would be really great if messages that are not relevant for
upgrading of a package will be shown only for the first install.
For example, I've just finished upgrading of Gentoo on my notebook and I
was spammed with heaps of messages. They are for 10 packages. From them
messages for net-misc/dhcpcd, net-misc/tor, sci-physics/root,
mail-client/thunderbird, www-client/firefox and sci-libs/scipy are
typical and not relevant for update. It means for 6 from 10 packages
(Only message for dev-libs/boost is quite original with its red color )) ).
It is of course not very important issue, but it is quite annoying.



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Re: [gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[Ian Stakenvicius]

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On 03/11/12 08:19 PM, Jauhien Piatlicki wrote:
> 03.11.12 09:04, Ben de Groot написав(ла):
>> On 31 October 2012 23:17, Chris Reffett <creffett@gentoo.org>
>> wrote:
>>> Basically, I would rather the user get too many elog messages
>>> than not enough, since I feel that a lot of people skip over
>>> them anyway and so the "only display once" method makes it far 
>>> too easy for important messages to get lost in the shuffle.
>> 
>> Did you ever consider *why* so many users skip over elog
>> messages? Don't you think that could be because most of these
>> messages of useless to them, or they have already seem them many
>> times?
>> 
>> I think we need to come up with a better policy regarding elog 
>> messages, which would improve the signal to noise ratio.
>> 
> 
> Yes, it would be really great if messages that are not relevant
> for upgrading of a package will be shown only for the first
> install. For example, I've just finished upgrading of Gentoo on my
> notebook and I was spammed with heaps of messages. They are for 10
> packages. From them messages for net-misc/dhcpcd, net-misc/tor,
> sci-physics/root, mail-client/thunderbird, www-client/firefox and
> sci-libs/scipy are typical and not relevant for update. It means
> for 6 from 10 packages (Only message for dev-libs/boost is quite
> original with its red color )) ). It is of course not very
> important issue, but it is quite annoying.
> 
> 

As of EAPI=4 (i think? maybe 3?) ebuild authors can use a simple test
to see if $REPLACING_VERSIONS is empty or not to indicate whether the
package is being newly installed or if it's being upgraded.  Maybe, if
package maintainers are so inclined, we can start using this feature
to reduce the spam.  (if we were really motivated we could even only
provide relevant messages based on the version being replaced!)



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Re: [gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[Ben de Groot]

On 4 November 2012 08:28, Ian Stakenvicius <axs@gentoo.org> wrote:
>> 03.11.12 09:04, Ben de Groot написав(ла):
>>> I think we need to come up with a better policy regarding elog
>>> messages, which would improve the signal to noise ratio.
>>>
> As of EAPI=4 (i think? maybe 3?) ebuild authors can use a simple test
> to see if $REPLACING_VERSIONS is empty or not to indicate whether the
> package is being newly installed or if it's being upgraded.  Maybe, if
> package maintainers are so inclined, we can start using this feature
> to reduce the spam.  (if we were really motivated we could even only
> provide relevant messages based on the version being replaced!)

I think that would be a good idea. I would like to see repoman
complain about elog messages without REPLACING_VERSIONS.

-- 
Cheers,

Ben | yngwin
Gentoo developer
Gentoo Qt project lead, Gentoo Wiki admin

Re: [gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[Zac Medico]

On 11/03/2012 09:29 PM, Ben de Groot wrote:
> On 4 November 2012 08:28, Ian Stakenvicius <axs@gentoo.org> wrote:
>>> 03.11.12 09:04, Ben de Groot написав(ла):
>>>> I think we need to come up with a better policy regarding elog
>>>> messages, which would improve the signal to noise ratio.
>>>>
>> As of EAPI=4 (i think? maybe 3?) ebuild authors can use a simple test
>> to see if $REPLACING_VERSIONS is empty or not to indicate whether the
>> package is being newly installed or if it's being upgraded.  Maybe, if
>> package maintainers are so inclined, we can start using this feature
>> to reduce the spam.  (if we were really motivated we could even only
>> provide relevant messages based on the version being replaced!)
> 
> I think that would be a good idea. I would like to see repoman
> complain about elog messages without REPLACING_VERSIONS.

I think has_version calls are also a good indicator that the ebuild is
doing the right thing.

Parsing bash can be somewhat error-prone for repoman, some I'd suggest a
simple rule like "Warn if elog is called and the ebuild does not contain
any calls to the has_version function or references to the
REPLACING_VERSIONS variable."
-- 
Thanks,
Zac

Re: [gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[Rich Freeman]

On Wed, Oct 31, 2012 at 8:31 AM, Dirkjan Ochtman <djc@gentoo.org> wrote:
>
> If you're going to file bugs "in a semi-automated manner", might as
> well try to assign to the correct maintainer?

How about a policy - no automated bugs may be logged to the bug
wranglers without their prior approval/review.

I wouldn't think about running a script against somebody's
bugzilla/repository/forum/whatever without some kind of prior
communication with the administrators.  This usually is considered
abuse.

Rich

Re: [gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[lists]

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Maybe you should remember that non-devs simply /aren't allowed/ to
assign bugs correctly...

And if you look closer into these bugs, you might discover that jer
instructed this guy to file separate bugs. (see #440178)

aranea

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Re: [gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[Rich Freeman]

On Wed, Oct 31, 2012 at 9:18 AM,  <lists@aixah.de> wrote:
> Maybe you should remember that non-devs simply /aren't allowed/ to
> assign bugs correctly...
>
> And if you look closer into these bugs, you might discover that jer
> instructed this guy to file separate bugs. (see #440178)
>

Fair points, and clearly this wasn't malicious.  I think we still want
to find a better solution than logging dozens of bugs for the
wranglers.  Perhaps where there is a need we can give elevated privs
in bugzilla to those running scripts who understand what they're
doing.  Or non-devs could ask a dev to run the script for them after
review.

Rich

Re: [gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[Michael Orlitzky]

On 10/31/2012 10:05 AM, Rich Freeman wrote:
> On Wed, Oct 31, 2012 at 9:18 AM,  <lists@aixah.de> wrote:
>> Maybe you should remember that non-devs simply /aren't allowed/ to
>> assign bugs correctly...
>>
>> And if you look closer into these bugs, you might discover that jer
>> instructed this guy to file separate bugs. (see #440178)
>>
> 
> Fair points, and clearly this wasn't malicious.  I think we still want
> to find a better solution than logging dozens of bugs for the
> wranglers.  Perhaps where there is a need we can give elevated privs
> in bugzilla to those running scripts who understand what they're
> doing.  Or non-devs could ask a dev to run the script for them after
> review.

This would be nice anyway. I'm generally capable of reading metadata.xml
and determining whether or not to tag my bugs with e.g. STABLEREQ.

One less bug to wrangle.

Re: [gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[Cyprien Nicolas]

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On Wed, Oct 31, 2012 at 02:18:42pm +0100, lists@aixah.de wrote:
> maybe you should remember that non-devs simply /aren't allowed/ to
> assign bugs correctly...

That is not correct. I am no dev and i do have edit-bugs privileges.

They were given to me on request by a developer from a project i am
contributing to. However, that developer *has to* review any change I
do, as he/she is responsible for my mistakes.

The other way is to join the bug-wranglers project if you are willing
to help:

   http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/qa/bug-wranglers/index.xml#doc_chap4

-- 
Cyprien Nicolas (fulax)
Gentoo Lisp Project contrib

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Re: [gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[Alec Warner]

On Wed, Oct 31, 2012 at 5:54 AM, Rich Freeman <rich0@gentoo.org> wrote:
> On Wed, Oct 31, 2012 at 8:31 AM, Dirkjan Ochtman <djc@gentoo.org> wrote:
>>
>> If you're going to file bugs "in a semi-automated manner", might as
>> well try to assign to the correct maintainer?
>
> How about a policy - no automated bugs may be logged to the bug
> wranglers without their prior approval/review.
>
> I wouldn't think about running a script against somebody's
> bugzilla/repository/forum/whatever without some kind of prior
> communication with the administrators.  This usually is considered
> abuse.
>
> Rich
>

Bugzilla has a supported scripting API (via XMLRPC), and infra
supports people using it, so from our POV this is legitimate.

-A

[gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[Alex Alexander]

Our bug queue has 100 bugs!

If you have some spare time, please help assign/sort a few bugs.

To view the bug queue, click here: http://bit.ly/m8PQS5

Thanks!

[gentoo-dev] [warning] the bug queue has 100 bugs

[Alex Alexander]

Our bug queue has 100 bugs!

If you have some spare time, please help assign/sort a few bugs.

To view the bug queue, click here: http://bit.ly/m8PQS5

Thanks!