From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org ([208.92.234.80] helo=lists.gentoo.org) by finch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1S88VH-00036P-Uw for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Thu, 15 Mar 2012 11:05:56 +0000 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id B5C42E0AF2; Thu, 15 Mar 2012 11:05:44 +0000 (UTC) Received: from qmta06.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta06.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [76.96.62.56]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4CADCE0A5F for ; Thu, 15 Mar 2012 11:05:10 +0000 (UTC) Received: from omta19.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.98]) by qmta06.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id lmhT1i00327AodY56n5BbJ; Thu, 15 Mar 2012 11:05:11 +0000 Received: from [192.168.1.13] ([76.106.69.86]) by omta19.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id ln591i01T1rgsis3fn5AMM; Thu, 15 Mar 2012 11:05:11 +0000 Message-ID: <4F61CCD4.9000002@gentoo.org> Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2012 07:04:52 -0400 From: Joshua Kinard User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.0; WOW64; rv:10.0) Gecko/20120129 Thunderbird/10.0 Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Let's redesign the entire filesystem! References: <4F5C1BE9.3040609@gentoo.org> <20120311173355.GB6599@linux1> <4F5EA152.80604@gentoo.org> <4F5FE34A.4030609@gentoo.org> <4F6091CE.1050009@gentoo.org> <20120314144115.GA30606@kroah.com> <20120314145144.GC3200@ca.inter.net> <20120314150431.GA2033@kroah.com> In-Reply-To: <20120314150431.GA2033@kroah.com> X-Enigmail-Version: 1.3.5 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------enigFD88D1E7C7F08834CA69D75E" X-Archives-Salt: 7eefb71f-035e-484a-aeec-030396aefb88 X-Archives-Hash: e3df45fa7d3f9fcebdb4727bae12c1bc This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --------------enigFD88D1E7C7F08834CA69D75E Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 03/14/2012 11:04, Greg KH wrote: >=20 > Not always, no, it isn't obvious that something didn't start up > correctly, or that it didn't fully load properly. Some programs later > on recover and handle things better. I'm well aware of what I run on my own box, and when something isn't running, I figure it out pretty quickly. I tested udev-181 in a Gentoo V= M that I put together recently, giving it a separate /usr, and made sure th= at CONFIG_DEVTMPFS was enbaled. The only service that failed to load proper= ly at startup was udev, specifically because udevadm couldn't locate libkmod= (likely because kmod installs into /usr/lib*, which wasn't available yet because I also don't use an initramfs in my kernel). Everything else wor= ked fine, and udev later started properly once localmount was complete. I even tried, out of curiosity, to tweak things and moved udev from sysin= it to boot and then to default runlevel. In 'boot', udevadm still fails to load, so no change. In 'default', only net.lo failed because the 'lo' device didn't yet exist until after udev was running. udev itself loaded= fine, and the networking scripts restarted themselves. So with the one exception of networking, which in Linux, has never create= d /dev nodes (has to be some historical piece on why), one almost doesn't n= eed udev at boot to even get things working on a very simple setup like mine.= And since udev is the one service that didn't load correctly, one COULD p= ut forth the hypothesis that it is udev that is "broken". But I doubt that will get much traction, right? This does lead me to wonder if a light-weight udev could exist that lacks= half or more of the functionality of the current udev. I'll be honest, I= 've only edited my udev rules file once, and that was only when I installed a= Sun Happy Meal quad ethernet card in which all four ports utilize the sam= e MAC address and udev doesn't handle this very gracefully (if I had Solari= s, I could edit the card's firmware and change this setting). Devtmpfs quite literally handles 98% of my particular usage scenario. Do= es that apply to everyone? Nope. Just an interesting observation. --=20 Joshua Kinard Gentoo/MIPS kumba@gentoo.org 4096R/D25D95E3 2011-03-28 "The past tempts us, the present confuses us, the future frightens us. A= nd our lives slip away, moment by moment, lost in that vast, terrible in-bet= ween." --Emperor Turhan, Centauri Republic --------------enigFD88D1E7C7F08834CA69D75E Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.17 (MingW32) iQIcBAEBAgAGBQJPYczVAAoJENsjoH7SXZXjnEEQAIlw2BOjOFz5HONMN9szYX6e aUFrrZXvYse28I8OvD1q/WhggVyeHy72uDkgth7RuiCgy8z/5eWV9ghRVRkZNUK8 uqfIQpmv2JxIdUBrZxEhw9vHibNWFrSapcpp+1PFreg0qMIob0TeYxEfylg4BhHS n/V/1UdgViHzoPmssB19RPMLEc8+1ETOWxQ1hk+hjrsd2g1APCnFm5cvWvy9+f+B WgpUkMRNnKBleEOWBKJgDkE6QVGA/y3PwV2xt2ACzrJ8dHu5nFMyqvlAQbz/X6vj KDKKt2+c2/gprGU068kDNFoE+ZxvGw/5MKsvCJlsQhcDuYQpjx974Y4q9EVTQhzQ /YGQJv95/5GCOsX7PMGa9linc2MlO0dIRUyGMJ6mKc/tzJ+JSt3Zm16Rxak5WzBv 4SS6uA60froX1D+YLTxKxqbmQ75JijoelIIUc5vGjzokBaHM0DL3tXU/sjpshc3m viA06u1vLAo06SpaqyJQZcR07Y0fDcKNuEAZVBUmrKEf8iE3BBYAJBdkLXCxkdLq iaAU6P941UzIH8DCGo9jpoENQ/Rm1s2Wmbwb4UUPar6X8NFWnYY9DlJaPepTEZ9S AGNtzAJDLtXZXXfZMBb5QFkcR5yp7nKFpC/cNPRhDm95Ca4pXRt2WEGeWoAHg1oC ytV7VKXPl9Qcsg9bl4Sa =1zYW -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------enigFD88D1E7C7F08834CA69D75E--