From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org ([208.92.234.80] helo=lists.gentoo.org) by finch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1OPLsd-0004i9-3J for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Thu, 17 Jun 2010 20:40:07 +0000 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id B2BB4E0B38; Thu, 17 Jun 2010 20:40:04 +0000 (UTC) Received: from dev.gentooexperimental.org (unknown [91.191.147.225]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 944D2E0A7F for ; Thu, 17 Jun 2010 20:39:54 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [192.168.2.100] (dslb-084-058-102-195.pools.arcor-ip.net [84.58.102.195]) by dev.gentooexperimental.org (Postfix) with ESMTPA id C170E6467E for ; Thu, 17 Jun 2010 20:39:53 +0000 (Local time zone must be set--see zic manual page) Message-ID: <4C1A8819.7040006@gentoo.org> Date: Thu, 17 Jun 2010 22:39:53 +0200 From: Patrick Lauer User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux x86_64; en-US; rv:1.9.1.9) Gecko/20100509 Thunderbird/3.0.4 Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Proposing fundamental changes to DevRel References: <4C196595.20600@gentoo.org> <4C19D43C.6080207@gentoo.org> <4C1A38AB.2080907@gentoo.org> <4C1A4321.2040201@gentoo.org> <4C1A4B7B.6070301@gentoo.org> <4C1A80FC.6020605@gentoo.org> In-Reply-To: <4C1A80FC.6020605@gentoo.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Archives-Salt: f0a70d00-cf7c-45b0-bb5b-0d1e4bd6d9f9 X-Archives-Hash: 1c5e5274c6b6cfc2d3683f51c3556a15 On 06/17/10 22:09, Sebastian Pipping wrote: > Patrick, > > > On 06/17/10 18:21, Patrick Lauer wrote: >> Now of course this will cause friction. I've noticed it especially with >> germanic and slavic languages that are more terse than english. >> For example "Sit down!" is acceptable in all situations in german, > > maybe acceptable, sure not polite or friendly. "Hey, komm, setz dich." "Ey, du Arsch, setz dich, sonst schmeiss ich dich raus!" exactly the same words, just defined by the context - and if you leave that away it's only intonation. The english or french equivalent ends up as different sentences ... >> You can extrapolate the friction this can and will cause. So unless >> someone actively personally insults me I'll just assume it got lost in >> translation. > > I understand "extrapolating friction" as having the receiver fixing > potential miscommunication. Is that what you meant? I meant to say "you can easily guess how much trouble that causes" And here we see how difficult languages can be as you managed to get something quite different out of it ... [snip] >> So let's not get too hung up on single words, stop >> floodmailing and resume fixing bugs, mmmhkay? > > Are you asking me to shut up? > In case floodmailing refers to me: I'm not done yet. You're one of the more persistent persons on the mailing lists. I don't see the point of arguing the same thing for days with no end in sight ... for me, personally, there are better ways to use my time. For example reading the quizzes my recruits are working on and pointing out the problems they still have. Or bugwrangling a bit just for fun. > We have more or less ignored non-technical issues for quite some time > concentrating on technical issues as that's easier. The thing is: > Technical things work much better in Gentoo than non-technical things. > > Let me repeat: Technical is not our main problem. Ok then. What's the possible solutions? Which options do we have, what are their advantages and disadvantages? Why didn't we apply that solution before? Just complaining that things suck and life isn't fair won't help. Finding a goal and working towards it until you are done will. Have fun, Patrick