From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org ([208.92.234.80] helo=lists.gentoo.org) by finch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1NndsW-0003JD-7l for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Fri, 05 Mar 2010 20:12:08 +0000 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id C725EE0F1F; Fri, 5 Mar 2010 20:12:05 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-qy0-f188.google.com (mail-qy0-f188.google.com [209.85.221.188]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8C721E0C0A for ; Fri, 5 Mar 2010 20:11:57 +0000 (UTC) Received: by qyk26 with SMTP id 26so3283103qyk.12 for ; Fri, 05 Mar 2010 12:11:57 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from :user-agent:mime-version:to:subject:references:in-reply-to :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=AIGuJ002kPvyJrgYXRNAWA3gIgq4HLdLamsQljNd+xQ=; b=A5TDSwzUa552Kqd6z0SrVvZ2eorIR0MK+h9gWxpKmI0gyUINeSXHs6Om03fMXPvrT9 VOTT8MnS0RNCzYa7pruHYTd4oZ/smMaRMQDnDZeiAv1G5pSD92SCAHZYqWE/6YhJzNdr i5XPVe+vvNVqf4YTincbG5n16DxFLpk+j24Wg= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:user-agent:mime-version:to:subject:references :in-reply-to:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=CRsP6cEG1g6SNyvsVQ7i7EeYsUucPaPk3LTnBmswOwa9t/eVbxs2QDlP8RIb4Bqx0D ZCEd9UBv0qkGiMEW1j9hUc9XloORVPkQTqJ7JaZuQtVSoIkG4aU/pYHBUpus1X3hd+lD gtw5fL5Wz4FkwwA5jIGA99/gD7CkKlAPxgWL8= Received: by 10.224.96.7 with SMTP id f7mr705479qan.241.1267819917244; Fri, 05 Mar 2010 12:11:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.1] (adsl-0-94-66.jan.bellsouth.net [65.0.94.66]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id 5sm4817883qwg.3.2010.03.05.12.11.55 (version=SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Fri, 05 Mar 2010 12:11:56 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <4B916589.2010201@gmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2010 14:11:53 -0600 From: Dale User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.9.1.8) Gecko/20100304 Gentoo/2.0.3 SeaMonkey/2.0.3 Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] [RFC] Remove cups from default profile to solve circular deps References: <1267805560.3086.0@NeddySeagoon> <201003051903.32648.cla@gentoo.org> <1267814288.6970.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> In-Reply-To: <1267814288.6970.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Archives-Salt: c4d6d68b-a7f4-4ff3-89c0-8f3b2a92207c X-Archives-Hash: c7cca2a9fd6eb705101ff40740cdd91a chrome://messenger/locale/messengercompose/composeMsgs.properties: > El vie, 05-03-2010 a las 19:03 +0100, Dawid W=C4=99gli=C5=84ski escribi= =C3=B3: > =20 >> On Friday 05 March 2010 17:12:23 Roy Bamford wrote: >> >> =20 >>> That's not a new install as per the handbook. Neither are you a new >>> user as you have a premade make.conf and world file and some experien= ce >>> with Gentoo. >>> >>> Put yourself in the place of a brand new Gentoo user doing his/her >>> first install. >>> >>> It needs to just work out of the box, one way or another, without >>> forums posts or calls for help in #gentoo about circular dependences. >>> That's not just cups - thats all circular dependencies. >>> =20 >> Brand new gentoo user goes throu handbook -> reads "set up USE variab= les in >> make.conf" and does it according to his/her needs following use.*.desc= . If >> gentoo was new to me i *would* enter cups as i use printers often at w= ork. >> >> =20 > +1 > > I did it (I mean, add some commonly used USE flags) in all my Gentoo > installations, and I would add "cups" for sure (since printing is used > every day in most machines I use and administrate). > > Leio pointed some messages ago about the possibility of splitting some > poppler parts to fix this circular dep issue, what is the problem with > that option? The suggestion is not about splitting every poppler part i= n > tons of ebuilds, but simply split poppler in the minimum needed to fix > this problem (sorry if I missed the reply, I haven't followed discussio= n > too deeply :-( ) > > Thanks and best regards > =20 This is what I am saying. *IF* cups were some little known or obscure=20 USE flag, one could make the argument that it would not be set until=20 later on. I started with Gentoo over 6 years ago. I had only used=20 anything Linux for a few months. I knew what cups was. Even tho I was=20 new to Linux when I first installed Mandrake, I knew I had a printer. =20 It was a old used one at the time but I still had a printer. I wanted=20 that printer to work. Mandrake picked that up for me, Gentoo is not=20 that way. I have to pick that up, not the OS. I am also saying that this needs a long term fix. I'm thinking a long=20 term fix like happened with the blocks issue. If in the short term this=20 USE flag ha to be removed, then fine. It's doesn't really fix anything=20 is my opinion. If a user turns that flag on as is in the docs, the=20 problem is still there. This is why we need a long term fix. This may=20 take a good while, months, year, who knows. This just should not be=20 called "fixed" when the problem is still there. Please don't just=20 remove the USE flag and forget the reason it happened. This is Gentoo. =20 I'm proud to tell people I use it. I want it to stay on top of the pile=20 not fall to the bottom. Dale :-) :-)