[gentoo-dev] CJK testing

[gentoo-dev] CJK testing

[Stuart Bouyer]

Greetings All,

I've masked two ebuilds for testing with CJK (Chinese, Japanese, Korean)
support. Can both CJK and non-CJK users test these please, so that I can
unmask them.

Thanks in advance

Stuart Bouyer

Re: [gentoo-dev] CJK testing

[Stuart Bouyer]

Sorry for the stupidity, 

the packages are

net-mail/mutt-1.4-r2.ebuild
dev-db/postgresql-7.2.1-r2.ebuild


On 日, 2002-07-28 at 22:28, Stuart Bouyer wrote:
> Greetings All,
> 
> I've masked two ebuilds for testing with CJK (Chinese, Japanese, Korean)
> support. Can both CJK and non-CJK users test these please, so that I can
> unmask them.
> 
> Thanks in advance
> 
> Stuart Bouyer
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> gentoo-dev mailing list
> gentoo-dev@gentoo.org
> http://lists.gentoo.org/mailman/listinfo/gentoo-dev

Re: [gentoo-dev] CJK testing

[Marko Mikulicic]

Stuart Bouyer wrote:
> Sorry for the stupidity, 
> 
> the packages are
> 
> net-mail/mutt-1.4-r2.ebuild
> dev-db/postgresql-7.2.1-r2.ebuild

I'm already changed the postgresql ebuild like you did
and I used "--enable-multibyte" for some time. It works.
You ebuild compiles well.
  The only problem I see is the name "CJK".
I use unicode for other languages, for example in order to have in the 
same database latin1 and latin2. Is difficult to guess for an 
east-european user that it should use "CJK" for it's language.
I would prefer if the use flag should be called in a more general way.
  (unicode)

Marko

Re: [gentoo-dev] CJK testing

[Thomas Beaudry]

>>the packages are
>>
>>net-mail/mutt-1.4-r2.ebuild
>>dev-db/postgresql-7.2.1-r2.ebuild
>
>I'm already changed the postgresql ebuild like you did
>and I used "--enable-multibyte" for some time. It works.
>You ebuild compiles well.
>  The only problem I see is the name "CJK".
>I use unicode for other languages, for example in order to have in the
>same database latin1 and latin2. Is difficult to guess for an
>east-european user that it should use "CJK" for it's language.
>I would prefer if the use flag should be called in a more general way.
>  (unicode)
>
>Marko

I'm with Marko.  The use flag should be unicode.  More accurate
description of what it's for even if people are only using it for
CJK support at the moment.


_________________________________________________________________
MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: 
http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx

Re: [gentoo-dev] CJK testing

[Stuart Bouyer]

On 月, 2002-07-29 at 01:59, Thomas Beaudry wrote:
> >>the packages are
> >>
> >>net-mail/mutt-1.4-r2.ebuild
> >>dev-db/postgresql-7.2.1-r2.ebuild
> >
> >I'm already changed the postgresql ebuild like you did
> >and I used "--enable-multibyte" for some time. It works.
> >You ebuild compiles well.
> >  The only problem I see is the name "CJK".
> >I use unicode for other languages, for example in order to have in the
> >same database latin1 and latin2. Is difficult to guess for an
> >east-european user that it should use "CJK" for it's language.
> >I would prefer if the use flag should be called in a more general way.
> >  (unicode)
> >
> >Marko
> 
> I'm with Marko.  The use flag should be unicode.  More accurate
> description of what it's for even if people are only using it for
> CJK support at the moment.
> 
>
The reason that CJK was chosen was that untill postgresql, I have only
ever seen --enable-multibyte used for adding Asian font capabilities. It
wasn't till this response that I was even aware that postgresql used it
to add support for unicode (and others as well). I'll have to look at
this issue in more depth because on occasion adding Asian support
sometimes kills Russian or Greek support. May have to add an additional
flag. 

Unicode in this case is better, but not actually more accurate as
unicode is just 1 of many encodings that postgresql activate with
--enable-multibyte. multibyte or i18n might be more appropriate?

 
> _________________________________________________________________
> MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: 
> http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx
> 
> _______________________________________________
> gentoo-dev mailing list
> gentoo-dev@gentoo.org
> http://lists.gentoo.org/mailman/listinfo/gentoo-dev

Re: [gentoo-dev] CJK testing

[Thomas Beaudry]

> > I'm with Marko.  The use flag should be unicode.  More accurate
> > description of what it's for even if people are only using it for
> > CJK support at the moment.
>
>The reason that CJK was chosen was that untill postgresql, I have only
>ever seen --enable-multibyte used for adding Asian font capabilities. It
>wasn't till this response that I was even aware that postgresql used it
>to add support for unicode (and others as well). I'll have to look at
>this issue in more depth because on occasion adding Asian support
>sometimes kills Russian or Greek support. May have to add an additional
>flag.
>
>Unicode in this case is better, but not actually more accurate as
>unicode is just 1 of many encodings that postgresql activate with
>--enable-multibyte. multibyte or i18n might be more appropriate?

Multibyte sounds like the best to me.  i18n uses both single- and multi-
byte fonts so wouldn't be entirely accurate.


_________________________________________________________________
Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com

Re: [gentoo-dev] CJK testing

[Marko Mikulicic]

Thomas Beaudry wrote:
> 
>> > I'm with Marko.  The use flag should be unicode.  More accurate
>> > description of what it's for even if people are only using it for
>> > CJK support at the moment.
>>
>> The reason that CJK was chosen was that untill postgresql, I have only
>> ever seen --enable-multibyte used for adding Asian font capabilities. It
>> wasn't till this response that I was even aware that postgresql used it
>> to add support for unicode (and others as well). I'll have to look at
>> this issue in more depth because on occasion adding Asian support
>> sometimes kills Russian or Greek support. May have to add an additional
>> flag.

So, when someone wants russian and greek (together->unicode) in 
postgresql it has to enable CJK and then possibly break some other 
applications which have nothing to do with pgsql.

>>
>> Unicode in this case is better, but not actually more accurate as
>> unicode is just 1 of many encodings that postgresql activate with
>> --enable-multibyte. multibyte or i18n might be more appropriate?

I use always unicode inside the database because the client can choose
the encoding for the connection and an eventual conversion happens on
the fly. But someone may want to store the data internally in a specific 
encoding for performance issues.
  Automatic conversion can be disabled (and this saves performance and code
size).
  This make me think about the possibility to have a finer granularity
in configuring an ebuild:

1) Combinations of global use flags activate a ebuild-local use flag.
2) ebuild-local use flags have effect only on a given ebuild

for example:

global use flag: "unicode" -> local flag: "postgresql/multibyte"
global use flag: "cjk" -> local flag: "postgresql/multibyte"

pseudo code in ebuild: if use unicode or use then multibyte

"local" (a better name...) use flags are like use flags but prefixed 
with the ebuild name path.

/etc/make.conf:  USE="... cjk -postgresql/unicode-conversion"

this flags enable multibyte for Chinese-Japanese-Korean but
without the overhead of conversions to other encodings.

If this make sense to you I will elaborate it better and send
a feature bug. But if it is stupid tell me now :-)

> 
> Multibyte sounds like the best to me.  i18n uses both single- and multi-
> byte fonts so wouldn't be entirely accurate.

Multibyte is not bad as it is a 1-to-1 mapping with the configure flag,
but I think i may be confusing. The word "multibyte" doesn't associate
with text and encoding but to actual implementation.

Marko

Re: [gentoo-dev] CJK testing

[Cong]

Do you Marko use any of Japanese, Korean or Chinese?

Anyway, I believe that the patch for mutt-1.4-r2.ebuild
makes it useable for only Japanese users (including me).

mutt-1.4-r2.ebuild works well. Thank you.

Cong

On Sun, Jul 28, 2002 at 03:41:52PM +0200, Marko Mikulicic wrote:
> Stuart Bouyer wrote:
> >Sorry for the stupidity, 
> >
> >the packages are
> >
> >net-mail/mutt-1.4-r2.ebuild
> >dev-db/postgresql-7.2.1-r2.ebuild
> 
> I'm already changed the postgresql ebuild like you did
> and I used "--enable-multibyte" for some time. It works.
> You ebuild compiles well.
>  The only problem I see is the name "CJK".
> I use unicode for other languages, for example in order to have in the 
> same database latin1 and latin2. Is difficult to guess for an 
> east-european user that it should use "CJK" for it's language.
> I would prefer if the use flag should be called in a more general way.
>  (unicode)
> 
> Marko
> 
> 
> 
> 

-- 
Cong 

Re: [gentoo-dev] CJK testing

[Marko Mikulicic]

Cong wrote:
 > Do you Marko use any of Japanese, Korean or Chinese?
Not really. Watakushi wa nihon go wakarimasen :-)
I'd like to see japanese support for emacs
since I like to play with foreign languages and emacs
was the simpler solution for inputing hiragana and kanji
that I've seen. (it worked on mandrake but on gentoo is missing)
   I don't know what to input hiragana in mutt or in kde :-(
I know how it works internally but I don't know how to use it like an
user :-(
   What should I install to test CJK support. Terminal ? I see no kterm.
How do you write hiragana and kanji in kde/gnome/mozilla ?

 >
 > Anyway, I believe that the patch for mutt-1.4-r2.ebuild
 > makes it useable for only Japanese users (including me).
Yes, this case is different from postgresql.

Marko

Re: [gentoo-dev] CJK testing

[Stuart Bouyer]

On 月, 2002-07-29 at 08:49, Marko Mikulicic wrote:

<snip> 
> 1) Combinations of global use flags activate a ebuild-local use flag.
> 2) ebuild-local use flags have effect only on a given ebuild
> 
> for example:
> 
> global use flag: "unicode" -> local flag: "postgresql/multibyte"
> global use flag: "cjk" -> local flag: "postgresql/multibyte"
> 
> pseudo code in ebuild: if use unicode or use then multibyte
> 
> "local" (a better name...) use flags are like use flags but prefixed 
> with the ebuild name path.
> 

This will hopefully be possible in a later version of portage, but alas
not at present.

Rather than add a new flag at present, I've gone with nls (for native
language support). This seemed the simplest answer as most users using
non-english apps will probably have this on anyway.

I've made the change, but haven't unmasked yet to give people a chance
to check whether this breaks anything.

cheers

Stuart