From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from lists.gentoo.org ([140.105.134.102] helo=robin.gentoo.org) by nuthatch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.62) (envelope-from ) id 1I7X5Y-0005Em-0w for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Sun, 08 Jul 2007 13:46:12 +0000 Received: from robin.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by robin.gentoo.org (8.14.0/8.14.0) with SMTP id l68DjFN4019059; Sun, 8 Jul 2007 13:45:15 GMT Received: from ug-out-1314.google.com (ug-out-1314.google.com [66.249.92.174]) by robin.gentoo.org (8.14.0/8.14.0) with ESMTP id l68DhK3o016713 for ; Sun, 8 Jul 2007 13:43:20 GMT Received: by ug-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id a2so1078677ugf for ; Sun, 08 Jul 2007 06:43:20 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=mzTwWGZQg0xoG2j5svwtYBWanPfTwj5v7XegZVVjlHr2LzEIGOdd/QGj/qNN46d5/fakJSBqTcltMS/7S3T8yeQvqKrbFNqTaLg+ZQpvQ038vu//D3yyETRXIJDx4B7cybLZCEiK17NvUELdhqNiIGxKOZ6Dmz0nS7v6MhVU80M= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=adlKpNbTWsi4nTFmcEMYm92Wiiaw2uqzVqDrO+LgYvKpcYr27HT/sxYkhvwZI7nDGe25b5Vu+qA0TtOuwezW/bM/Qak6fLU7PwLWSCQz8DeaMUDYiWwInp3Pt9CL5PUNSOO+VqIsx3jCsB7eycvhnMz/4PmGPJAZK+YKSpeDL+Q= Received: by 10.78.131.8 with SMTP id e8mr1090357hud.1183902200267; Sun, 08 Jul 2007 06:43:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.78.46.12 with HTTP; Sun, 8 Jul 2007 06:43:20 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <2bd962720707080643u48830d70vcdf3130a8dd1484f@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sun, 8 Jul 2007 09:43:20 -0400 From: "Ryan Reich" To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Inotify and (f)crontabs In-Reply-To: Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <2bd962720707010748g6fcb96cfw47a85610aadc9f79@mail.gmail.com> <200707072321.28435.vapier@gentoo.org> <2bd962720707072107w5f9594cdl6d6183262ed103df@mail.gmail.com> <200707080022.49121.vapier@gentoo.org> X-Archives-Salt: b300b506-fe0d-4322-8ca5-4360775524ee X-Archives-Hash: 4c8934c6bc1bea2c77cb19d85569b99c On 7/8/07, Steve Long wrote: > Mike Frysinger wrote: > > run-crons is a default helper for crons that just works. if you want to > > not use it but opt for anacron instead, nothing is stopping you from doing > > exactly that. > > I think Mr Frysinger is grudgingly conceding the point, so can we have some > stats eg on CPU time saved blah blah blah? But it'd be really sweet if you > could post em on the forums, as the technical discussion seems over for > now. (At least to this friendly-coder ;-)) > > ie: market it to the user base please, not the devs ;) > > Please be sure that this works from a clean install and test it on a live > box as the only system-- for a period of at least a week, as you collect > sample data. A write up of how to make it work would be ideal for > Documentation, Tips & Tricks imo. > > "2 of 5 - recall to pub" *bzzt*.. click. Well, as you can tell from the fact that I use fcron, this point is of academic interest to me. It's also secondary to my main concern in this thread, which is getting Gentoo to use incron; right now I'm just waiting for people to comment on the ebuild I posted yesterday. In my opinion, this is really an issue for the developers, and indeed I think Mike Frysinger agrees with that since he views the periodic scripts (now handled by run-crons) to be something that should "just work", i.e. be beneath the notice of the user. Replacing it with an anacron setup that "just works" should be equivalent from the user's perspective. After all, how much of Gentoo is carefully preconfigured to "just work" out of the box? Until I installed fcron, the file I saw most often in /etc was make.conf. It's one thing to have to configure cron to do your daily chores; that's necessary, of course, since only you can know what you want done (but note that Gentoo already includes daily makewhatis and updatedb jobs, which are the two big ones). It's another to have anacron set up just to do the generalized task of handling this; the user doesn't even need to know it's there. Just like they don't know that run-crons is there. As for CPU savings: are you kidding? Right now, run-crons is run every ten minutes, and anacron would be run on boot and every 24 hours thereafter. The advantages are clear. I don't think the users are invested in the particular implementation at all; since run-crons is, as Mr. Frysinger wrote in his original response to me, a "Gentooism", that question is really one for the developers. To be more pointed about it, it is not even my problem to justify using anacron, since this is the canonical answer to the question which Gentoo answers by using a home-grown script "run-crons". Whoever implemented run-crons should justify reinventing the wheel and explain how anacron's failings prevent it from working as intended (and why, at the same time, Gentoo also recommends installing it, or using fcron). I'm just here to ask them why. -- Ryan Reich -- gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list