RE: [gentoo-dev] New sys-kernel tree layout

RE: [gentoo-dev] New sys-kernel tree layout

[BoehmeSilvio]

Hi !

I use xfs on my desktop machine.
As I see, there are no performance patches in the xfs-source.

So, what is the GENTOO recommendation for a filesystem on a desktop machine
?

- xfs is good, but the kernel is missing all performance patches !
- ext3 is to slow IMHO (on IDE)
- ext2 has no journaling
- reiserfs is not recommended (gentoo install documentation), or is it safe
to use reiserfs now ?!

(Please don't start a flamewar about the best filesystem !!!)

Thanks

Silvio

Re: [gentoo-dev] New sys-kernel tree layout

[Craig Dooley]

Well, you've already narrowed your options down to two.  If you dont want reiserfs, that leaves xfs and ext3.  xfs is plenty fast, and the desktop patches arent going to make a world of difference.  If you feel their needed, they can be downloaded and patched manually.  Also, ext3 is no slower than ext2, so if thats the only complaint, go with ext3.  I have used both and both are fast and stable.  

-Craig


On Wed, 24 Apr 2002 10:34:00 +0200
BoehmeSilvio <Boehme.Silvio@afb.de> wrote:

> Hi !
> 
> I use xfs on my desktop machine.
> As I see, there are no performance patches in the xfs-source.
> 
> So, what is the GENTOO recommendation for a filesystem on a desktop machine
> ?
> 
> - xfs is good, but the kernel is missing all performance patches !
> - ext3 is to slow IMHO (on IDE)
> - ext2 has no journaling
> - reiserfs is not recommended (gentoo install documentation), or is it safe
> to use reiserfs now ?!
> 
> (Please don't start a flamewar about the best filesystem !!!)
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Silvio
> _______________________________________________
> gentoo-dev mailing list
> gentoo-dev@gentoo.org
> http://lists.gentoo.org/mailman/listinfo/gentoo-dev

Re: [gentoo-dev] New sys-kernel tree layout

[Miguel S. Filipe]

BoehmeSilvio wrote:

>Hi !
>
>I use xfs on my desktop machine.
>As I see, there are no performance patches in the xfs-source.
>
>So, what is the GENTOO recommendation for a filesystem on a desktop machine
>?
>
>- xfs is good, but the kernel is missing all performance patches !
>- ext3 is to slow IMHO (on IDE)
>- ext2 has no journaling
>- reiserfs is not recommended (gentoo install documentation), or is it safe
>to use reiserfs now ?!
>
I never understood why gentoo says this about reiserfs.
reiserfs is actively mantained in the kernel tree, it's allways getting 
updated and bugs are fixed every release, this for me is a signal that 
it's being very tested, and the fact that it's in the main kernel tree 
for some time, and I never saw in kerneltrap.com, or in any other web 
page related to the kernel, or the kernel mailing list.

I use reiserfs for a year now, in debian and now in gentoo, and I never 
had a problem with reiserfs.
(I have a normal desktop setup)
So, if you want a kernel with a fast file system, and other performance 
tweaks, go with reiserfs, preempt patch, and other similar stuff(that's 
what I do)

>
>(Please don't start a flamewar about the best filesystem !!!)
>
>Thanks
>
>Silvio
>_______________________________________________
>gentoo-dev mailing list
>gentoo-dev@gentoo.org
>http://lists.gentoo.org/mailman/listinfo/gentoo-dev
>

Re: [gentoo-dev] New sys-kernel tree layout

[Jean-Michel Smith]

On Wednesday 24 April 2002 03:46 pm, Miguel S. Filipe wrote:

> I never understood why gentoo says this about reiserfs.
> reiserfs is actively mantained in the kernel tree, it's allways getting
> updated and bugs are fixed every release, this for me is a signal that
> it's being very tested, and the fact that it's in the main kernel tree
> for some time, and I never saw in kerneltrap.com, or in any other web
> page related to the kernel, or the kernel mailing list.

I can't speak for gentoo, but I have personally witnessed data loss with 
reiserfs on a number of occasions ... a friend of mine had the dubious 
privelege of having that experience just a couple of weeks ago.

So while I cannot offer any insight into why the gentoo developers may have 
warned people away from reiser, I can tell you from personal experience that 
I'm glad they did, and only wish other distros had done the same.

As a user of XFS I too am frustrated at the occasional hiccup in support 
(which will undoubtably change once it is in the 2.5.x kernel), although even 
so I have never experienced a single bit of data loss ... just the annoying 
himem bug during install which I work around by installing onto an ext2 
partition and then copying over to a new xfs partition after I've booted a 
kernel with himem not compiled in.

One can add performance patches by hand to an XFS capable kernel, or make a 
custom ebuild to do so.  I've had good luck with the preemtable patch as well 
as the low latency patch (though I haven't gotten around to trying either 
against the current 2.4.19-r1 (xfs-sources) kernel yet).

Jean.

Re: [gentoo-dev] New sys-kernel tree layout

[Avi Schwartz]

I used reiserfs on 4 different SuSE 7.2 installations and on two of them
I ended up with a corrupt file system at one point or another.  I am
currently using ext3 on two Gentoo installation but I haven't used it
long enough to form an opinion yet.

Avi

On Wed, 2002-04-24 at 15:46, Miguel S. Filipe wrote:
> BoehmeSilvio wrote:
> 
> >- reiserfs is not recommended (gentoo install documentation), or is it safe
> >to use reiserfs now ?!
> >
> I never understood why gentoo says this about reiserfs.
> reiserfs is actively mantained in the kernel tree, it's allways getting 
> updated and bugs are fixed every release, this for me is a signal that 
> it's being very tested, and the fact that it's in the main kernel tree 
> for some time, and I never saw in kerneltrap.com, or in any other web 
> page related to the kernel, or the kernel mailing list.
-- 
Avi Schwartz
avi@CFFtechnologies.com

[gentoo-dev] New sys-kernel tree layout

[Daniel Robbins]

Hi all,

We now have a new arrangement in Portage's sys-kernel tree. 
sys-kernel/linux-sources no longer exists, and has been replaced with
the following consistently-named selection of kernel source packages:

gentoo-sources:

The gentoo-sources ebuild is our replacement for our previous
linux-sources ebuild.  It contains a "custom" Gentoo Linux kernel source
tree, optimized for server performance and desktop responsiveness.  We
try to ensure that this kernel is very fast and stable and we recommend
this kernel for most people.  However, XFS support is no longer included
in this kernel.  If you use XFS, use sys-kernel/xfs-sources.

vanilla-sources:

The vanilla-sources ebuild installs a "mainline" kernel source tree,
giving you the exact same thing as if you downloaded a stock kernel from
kernel.org.  It will be handy for those who use stock kernel source tree
-- now you can merge this kernel, and have a kernel source tree
installed to /usr/src automatically.

usermode-sources:

This usermode-sources ebuild installs mainline sources that have been
patched to support user-mode Linux (a special technology that allows you
to run "Linux inside Linux.")

xfs-sources:

The xfs-sources ebuild installs sources that support XFS; specifically,
this ebuild contains a CVS snapshot of SGI's own XFS source tree.  In
the future, we may add other minor (and stable) performance-enhancing
patches as well.  We've found that using a SGI XFS CVS shapshot is the
best way to go if you're going to use the XFS filesystem.  If any of
your Gentoo Linux filesystems are XFS, then, you'll need to use this
kernel.

openmosix-sources:

The openmosix-sources ebuild installs a kernel source tree that has been
specially patched with support for the GPL openMosix clustering and
load- balancing technology.  For more info, see
http://www.openmosix.com.

I hope you find the new layout more intuitive.  All ebuilds work
similarly and will install a kernel source tree to a directory inside
/usr/src and will set the /usr/src/linux symlink to point to this
directory.  We also plan to add a greater selection of kernels in the
future -- even customized kernels from other distributions like Mandrake
and Red Hat.

Best Regards,

-- 
Daniel Robbins                                  <drobbins@gentoo.org>
Chief Architect/President                       http://www.gentoo.org 
Gentoo Technologies, Inc.

Re: [gentoo-dev] New sys-kernel tree layout

[Andreas Waschbuesch]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

electrogramma illius Daniel Robbins profluit verbis:
> Hi all,
>
> We now have a new arrangement in Portage's sys-kernel tree.
> sys-kernel/linux-sources no longer exists, and has been replaced with
> the following consistently-named selection of kernel source packages:
> [snipped]

Nice Idea,

but still some packages depend on "linux-sources" and some headers are 
missing. *SIGH* (For nvidia-kernel the bug report is already submitted.)

Greets - Andrew

- -- 
Andreas Waschbuesch, GAUniversity KG MA FNZ FK01
eMail: awaschb@gwdg.de

Adding features does not necessarily increase functionality -- it just
makes the manuals thicker.
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Re: [gentoo-dev] New sys-kernel tree layout

[Joachim Blaabjerg]

On Tuesday 23 April 2002 15:05, Daniel Robbins wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> We now have a new arrangement in Portage's sys-kernel tree.
> sys-kernel/linux-sources no longer exists, and has been replaced with
> the following consistently-named selection of kernel source packages:
<snip>

How are things done with linux-headers, then? I don't use XFS, but I'd believe 
it adds/changes a few header files. I know grsecurity does, too (if we were 
to add secure-sources or whatever).

-- 
Joachim Blaabjerg
styx@SuxOS.org
www.SuxOS.org

Re: [gentoo-dev] New sys-kernel tree layout

[Jano Lukac]

Silly question:  which patches are included in the patch bzball?  I quickly
skimmed the patch, but it's a big file.  The ebuild only writes:

# INCLUDED:
#   2.4.16, plus:
#   2.4.17-pre4 (aka "2.4.16-pre4") openmosix

Which doesn't help me much ;)

Much obliged,
jano

Daniel Robbins said:
> Hi all,
>
> We now have a new arrangement in Portage's sys-kernel tree.
> sys-kernel/linux-sources no longer exists, and has been replaced with
> the following consistently-named selection of kernel source packages:
>
> gentoo-sources:
>
> The gentoo-sources ebuild is our replacement for our previous
> linux-sources ebuild.  It contains a "custom" Gentoo Linux kernel
> source tree, optimized for server performance and desktop
> responsiveness.  We try to ensure that this kernel is very fast and
> stable and we recommend this kernel for most people.  However, XFS
> support is no longer included in this kernel.  If you use XFS, use
> sys-kernel/xfs-sources.
>
> vanilla-sources:
>
> The vanilla-sources ebuild installs a "mainline" kernel source tree,
> giving you the exact same thing as if you downloaded a stock kernel
> from kernel.org.  It will be handy for those who use stock kernel
> source tree -- now you can merge this kernel, and have a kernel source
> tree
> installed to /usr/src automatically.
>
> usermode-sources:
>
> This usermode-sources ebuild installs mainline sources that have been
> patched to support user-mode Linux (a special technology that allows
> you to run "Linux inside Linux.")
>
> xfs-sources:
>
> The xfs-sources ebuild installs sources that support XFS; specifically,
> this ebuild contains a CVS snapshot of SGI's own XFS source tree.  In
> the future, we may add other minor (and stable) performance-enhancing
> patches as well.  We've found that using a SGI XFS CVS shapshot is the
> best way to go if you're going to use the XFS filesystem.  If any of
> your Gentoo Linux filesystems are XFS, then, you'll need to use this
> kernel.
>
> openmosix-sources:
>
> The openmosix-sources ebuild installs a kernel source tree that has
> been specially patched with support for the GPL openMosix clustering
> and load- balancing technology.  For more info, see
> http://www.openmosix.com.
>
> I hope you find the new layout more intuitive.  All ebuilds work
> similarly and will install a kernel source tree to a directory inside
> /usr/src and will set the /usr/src/linux symlink to point to this
> directory.  We also plan to add a greater selection of kernels in the
> future -- even customized kernels from other distributions like
> Mandrake and Red Hat.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> --
> Daniel Robbins                                  <drobbins@gentoo.org>
> Chief Architect/President                       http://www.gentoo.org
> Gentoo Technologies, Inc.
>
> _______________________________________________
> gentoo-dev mailing list
> gentoo-dev@gentoo.org
> http://lists.gentoo.org/mailman/listinfo/gentoo-dev