[gentoo-dev] net-misc/strongswan USE_EXPAND

[gentoo-dev] net-misc/strongswan USE_EXPAND

[Jason Zaman]

Hi all,

I want to add STRONGSWAN_PLUGINS to USE_EXPAND. This is related to bug
https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=504942
"net-misc/strongswan missing USE flags for plugins"

Patrick said to fix it myself, the ebuilds with the plugins have
been in the tree for a fair while now and only the USE_EXPAND is
missing.

If there are no objections, I will commit the following patch on friday:

-- Jason

Index: make.defaults
===================================================================
RCS file: /var/cvsroot/gentoo-x86/profiles/base/make.defaults,v
retrieving revision 1.127
diff -u -B -r1.127 make.defaults
--- make.defaults	5 Jun 2015 07:59:18 -0000	1.127
+++ make.defaults	22 Jun 2015 12:33:12 -0000
@@ -16,7 +16,7 @@
 
 # Env vars to expand into USE vars.  Modifying this requires prior
 # discussion on gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org.
-USE_EXPAND="ABI_MIPS ABI_PPC ABI_S390 ABI_X86 ALSA_CARDS APACHE2_MODULES APACHE2_MPMS CALLIGRA_FEATURES CAMERAS COLLECTD_PLUGINS CPU_FLAGS_X86 CROSSCOMPILE_OPTS CURL_SSL DRACUT_MODULES DVB_CARDS ELIBC ENLIGHTENMENT_MODULES FCDSL_CARDS FFTOOLS FOO2ZJS_DEVICES FRITZCAPI_CARDS GPSD_PROTOCOLS GRUB_PLATFORMS INPUT_DEVICES KERNEL LCD_DEVICES LIBREOFFICE_EXTENSIONS LINGUAS LIRC_DEVICES MONKEYD_PLUGINS NETBEANS_MODULES NGINX_MODULES_HTTP NGINX_MODULES_MAIL OFED_DRIVERS OFFICE_IMPLEMENTATION OPENMPI_FABRICS OPENMPI_OFED_FEATURES OPENMPI_RM PHP_TARGETS PYTHON_SINGLE_TARGET PYTHON_TARGETS QEMU_SOFTMMU_TARGETS QEMU_USER_TARGETS RUBY_TARGETS SANE_BACKENDS USERLAND UWSGI_PLUGINS VIDEO_CARDS VOICEMAIL_STORAGE XFCE_PLUGINS XTABLES_ADDONS"
+USE_EXPAND="ABI_MIPS ABI_PPC ABI_S390 ABI_X86 ALSA_CARDS APACHE2_MODULES APACHE2_MPMS CALLIGRA_FEATURES CAMERAS COLLECTD_PLUGINS CPU_FLAGS_X86 CROSSCOMPILE_OPTS CURL_SSL DRACUT_MODULES DVB_CARDS ELIBC ENLIGHTENMENT_MODULES FCDSL_CARDS FFTOOLS FOO2ZJS_DEVICES FRITZCAPI_CARDS GPSD_PROTOCOLS GRUB_PLATFORMS INPUT_DEVICES KERNEL LCD_DEVICES LIBREOFFICE_EXTENSIONS LINGUAS LIRC_DEVICES MONKEYD_PLUGINS NETBEANS_MODULES NGINX_MODULES_HTTP NGINX_MODULES_MAIL OFED_DRIVERS OFFICE_IMPLEMENTATION OPENMPI_FABRICS OPENMPI_OFED_FEATURES OPENMPI_RM PHP_TARGETS PYTHON_SINGLE_TARGET PYTHON_TARGETS QEMU_SOFTMMU_TARGETS QEMU_USER_TARGETS RUBY_TARGETS SANE_BACKENDS STRONGSWAN_PLUGINS USERLAND UWSGI_PLUGINS VIDEO_CARDS VOICEMAIL_STORAGE XFCE_PLUGINS XTABLES_ADDONS"
 
 # USE_EXPAND variables whose contents are not shown in package manager
 # output. Changes need discussion on gentoo-dev.

Re: [gentoo-dev] net-misc/strongswan USE_EXPAND

[Michał Górny]

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Dnia 2015-06-22, o godz. 16:38:30
Jason Zaman <perfinion@gentoo.org> napisał(a):

> Hi all,
> 
> I want to add STRONGSWAN_PLUGINS to USE_EXPAND. This is related to bug
> https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=504942
> "net-misc/strongswan missing USE flags for plugins"
> 
> Patrick said to fix it myself, the ebuilds with the plugins have
> been in the tree for a fair while now and only the USE_EXPAND is
> missing.
> 
> If there are no objections, I will commit the following patch on friday:

USE_EXPAND is global by its nature. USE flags used by a single package
are not appropriate for making global.

-- 
Best regards,
Michał Górny
<http://dev.gentoo.org/~mgorny/>

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Re: [gentoo-dev] net-misc/strongswan USE_EXPAND

[Jason Zaman]

On Mon, Jun 22, 2015 at 10:55:45PM +0200, Michał Górny wrote:
> Dnia 2015-06-22, o godz. 16:38:30
> Jason Zaman <perfinion@gentoo.org> napisał(a):
> 
> > Hi all,
> > 
> > I want to add STRONGSWAN_PLUGINS to USE_EXPAND. This is related to bug
> > https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=504942
> > "net-misc/strongswan missing USE flags for plugins"
> > 
> > Patrick said to fix it myself, the ebuilds with the plugins have
> > been in the tree for a fair while now and only the USE_EXPAND is
> > missing.
> > 
> > If there are no objections, I will commit the following patch on friday:
> 
> USE_EXPAND is global by its nature. USE flags used by a single package
> are not appropriate for making global.

Since when? There are so many things in USE_EXPAND that are only for a
single package.

APACHE2_MODULES, NGINX_MODULES_HTTP, COLLECTD_PLUGINS, QEMU_*, etc.
Easily half of the things in USE_EXPAND are for only a single package.

-- Jason

Re: [gentoo-dev] net-misc/strongswan USE_EXPAND

[NP-Hardass]

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There have been a couple of discussions about it previously, IIRC. The intent to dissuade new ones, not eliminate old ones AFAICR.

On June 22, 2015 5:23:13 PM EDT, Jason Zaman <jason@perfinion.com> wrote:
>On Mon, Jun 22, 2015 at 10:55:45PM +0200, Michał Górny wrote:
>> Dnia 2015-06-22, o godz. 16:38:30
>> Jason Zaman <perfinion@gentoo.org> napisał(a):
>> 
>> > Hi all,
>> > 
>> > I want to add STRONGSWAN_PLUGINS to USE_EXPAND. This is related to
>bug
>> > https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=504942
>> > "net-misc/strongswan missing USE flags for plugins"
>> > 
>> > Patrick said to fix it myself, the ebuilds with the plugins have
>> > been in the tree for a fair while now and only the USE_EXPAND is
>> > missing.
>> > 
>> > If there are no objections, I will commit the following patch on
>friday:
>> 
>> USE_EXPAND is global by its nature. USE flags used by a single
>package
>> are not appropriate for making global.
>
>Since when? There are so many things in USE_EXPAND that are only for a
>single package.
>
>APACHE2_MODULES, NGINX_MODULES_HTTP, COLLECTD_PLUGINS, QEMU_*, etc.
>Easily half of the things in USE_EXPAND are for only a single package.
>
>-- Jason

-- 
NP-Hardass

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Re: [gentoo-dev] net-misc/strongswan USE_EXPAND

[Zac Medico]

On 06/22/2015 02:23 PM, Jason Zaman wrote:
> On Mon, Jun 22, 2015 at 10:55:45PM +0200, Michał Górny wrote:
>> Dnia 2015-06-22, o godz. 16:38:30
>> Jason Zaman <perfinion@gentoo.org> napisał(a):
>>
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> I want to add STRONGSWAN_PLUGINS to USE_EXPAND. This is related to bug
>>> https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=504942
>>> "net-misc/strongswan missing USE flags for plugins"
>>>
>>> Patrick said to fix it myself, the ebuilds with the plugins have
>>> been in the tree for a fair while now and only the USE_EXPAND is
>>> missing.
>>>
>>> If there are no objections, I will commit the following patch on friday:
>>
>> USE_EXPAND is global by its nature. USE flags used by a single package
>> are not appropriate for making global.
> 
> Since when? There are so many things in USE_EXPAND that are only for a
> single package.
> 
> APACHE2_MODULES, NGINX_MODULES_HTTP, COLLECTD_PLUGINS, QEMU_*, etc.
> Easily half of the things in USE_EXPAND are for only a single package.
> 
> -- Jason
> 

Last time this came up, I suggested that we introduce a generic PLUGINS
USE_EXPAND than many packages could utilize. That way, the plugins are
still distinguished from the other flags in IUSE, but we don't have to
introduce a new USE_EXPAND for every package.
-- 
Thanks,
Zac

Re: [gentoo-dev] net-misc/strongswan USE_EXPAND

[Michał Górny]

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Dnia 2015-06-23, o godz. 01:23:13
Jason Zaman <jason@perfinion.com> napisał(a):

> On Mon, Jun 22, 2015 at 10:55:45PM +0200, Michał Górny wrote:
> > Dnia 2015-06-22, o godz. 16:38:30
> > Jason Zaman <perfinion@gentoo.org> napisał(a):
> > 
> > > Hi all,
> > > 
> > > I want to add STRONGSWAN_PLUGINS to USE_EXPAND. This is related to bug
> > > https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=504942
> > > "net-misc/strongswan missing USE flags for plugins"
> > > 
> > > Patrick said to fix it myself, the ebuilds with the plugins have
> > > been in the tree for a fair while now and only the USE_EXPAND is
> > > missing.
> > > 
> > > If there are no objections, I will commit the following patch on friday:
> > 
> > USE_EXPAND is global by its nature. USE flags used by a single package
> > are not appropriate for making global.
> 
> Since when? There are so many things in USE_EXPAND that are only for a
> single package.

Not sure when. But the policies about USE flags were in the devmanual
long before I came here.

> APACHE2_MODULES, NGINX_MODULES_HTTP, COLLECTD_PLUGINS, QEMU_*, etc.
> Easily half of the things in USE_EXPAND are for only a single package.

Past screwups don't justify future screwups.

-- 
Best regards,
Michał Górny
<http://dev.gentoo.org/~mgorny/>

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Re: [gentoo-dev] net-misc/strongswan USE_EXPAND

[Michał Górny]

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Dnia 2015-06-22, o godz. 14:40:42
Zac Medico <zmedico@gentoo.org> napisał(a):

> On 06/22/2015 02:23 PM, Jason Zaman wrote:
> > On Mon, Jun 22, 2015 at 10:55:45PM +0200, Michał Górny wrote:
> >> Dnia 2015-06-22, o godz. 16:38:30
> >> Jason Zaman <perfinion@gentoo.org> napisał(a):
> >>
> >>> Hi all,
> >>>
> >>> I want to add STRONGSWAN_PLUGINS to USE_EXPAND. This is related to bug
> >>> https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=504942
> >>> "net-misc/strongswan missing USE flags for plugins"
> >>>
> >>> Patrick said to fix it myself, the ebuilds with the plugins have
> >>> been in the tree for a fair while now and only the USE_EXPAND is
> >>> missing.
> >>>
> >>> If there are no objections, I will commit the following patch on friday:
> >>
> >> USE_EXPAND is global by its nature. USE flags used by a single package
> >> are not appropriate for making global.
> > 
> > Since when? There are so many things in USE_EXPAND that are only for a
> > single package.
> > 
> > APACHE2_MODULES, NGINX_MODULES_HTTP, COLLECTD_PLUGINS, QEMU_*, etc.
> > Easily half of the things in USE_EXPAND are for only a single package.
> > 
> > -- Jason
> > 
> 
> Last time this came up, I suggested that we introduce a generic PLUGINS
> USE_EXPAND than many packages could utilize. That way, the plugins are
> still distinguished from the other flags in IUSE, but we don't have to
> introduce a new USE_EXPAND for every package.

Soo... plugins.desc would describe plugins to a lot of different
packages? Like:

foo - [in bar] Support for libfoo, [in baz] does something a bit
different

-- 
Best regards,
Michał Górny
<http://dev.gentoo.org/~mgorny/>

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Re: [gentoo-dev] net-misc/strongswan USE_EXPAND

[Alexandre Rostovtsev]

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On Tue, 2015-06-23 at 07:06 +0200, Michał Górny wrote:
> Dnia 2015-06-23, o godz. 01:23:13
> Jason Zaman <jason@perfinion.com> napisał(a):
> 
> > On Mon, Jun 22, 2015 at 10:55:45PM +0200, Michał Górny wrote:
> > > Dnia 2015-06-22, o godz. 16:38:30
> > > Jason Zaman <perfinion@gentoo.org> napisał(a):
> > > 
> > > > Hi all,
> > > > 
> > > > I want to add STRONGSWAN_PLUGINS to USE_EXPAND. This is related 
> > > > to bug
> > > > https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=504942
> > > > "net-misc/strongswan missing USE flags for plugins"
> > > > 
> > > > Patrick said to fix it myself, the ebuilds with the plugins 
> > > > have
> > > > been in the tree for a fair while now and only the USE_EXPAND 
> > > > is
> > > > missing.
> > > > 
> > > > If there are no objections, I will commit the following patch 
> > > > on friday:
> > > 
> > > USE_EXPAND is global by its nature. USE flags used by a single 
> > > package
> > > are not appropriate for making global.
> > 
> > Since when? There are so many things in USE_EXPAND that are only 
> > for a
> > single package.
> 
> Not sure when. But the policies about USE flags were in the devmanual
> long before I came here.
> 
> > APACHE2_MODULES, NGINX_MODULES_HTTP, COLLECTD_PLUGINS, QEMU_*, etc.
> > Easily half of the things in USE_EXPAND are for only a single 
> > package.
> 
> Past screwups don't justify future screwups.

I don't see it as a screwup personally.

It is often useful to have different namespaces for the few general
flags that control a package's general features and the >9000 flags
that enable/disable >9000 highly specific plugins.

And if violation of the rules is useful, perhaps the rules are wrong?

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Re: [gentoo-dev] net-misc/strongswan USE_EXPAND

[Michał Górny]

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Dnia 2015-06-23, o godz. 01:48:58
Alexandre Rostovtsev <tetromino@gentoo.org> napisał(a):

> On Tue, 2015-06-23 at 07:06 +0200, Michał Górny wrote:
> > Dnia 2015-06-23, o godz. 01:23:13
> > Jason Zaman <jason@perfinion.com> napisał(a):
> > 
> > > On Mon, Jun 22, 2015 at 10:55:45PM +0200, Michał Górny wrote:
> > > > Dnia 2015-06-22, o godz. 16:38:30
> > > > Jason Zaman <perfinion@gentoo.org> napisał(a):
> > > > 
> > > > > Hi all,
> > > > > 
> > > > > I want to add STRONGSWAN_PLUGINS to USE_EXPAND. This is related 
> > > > > to bug
> > > > > https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=504942
> > > > > "net-misc/strongswan missing USE flags for plugins"
> > > > > 
> > > > > Patrick said to fix it myself, the ebuilds with the plugins 
> > > > > have
> > > > > been in the tree for a fair while now and only the USE_EXPAND 
> > > > > is
> > > > > missing.
> > > > > 
> > > > > If there are no objections, I will commit the following patch 
> > > > > on friday:
> > > > 
> > > > USE_EXPAND is global by its nature. USE flags used by a single 
> > > > package
> > > > are not appropriate for making global.
> > > 
> > > Since when? There are so many things in USE_EXPAND that are only 
> > > for a
> > > single package.
> > 
> > Not sure when. But the policies about USE flags were in the devmanual
> > long before I came here.
> > 
> > > APACHE2_MODULES, NGINX_MODULES_HTTP, COLLECTD_PLUGINS, QEMU_*, etc.
> > > Easily half of the things in USE_EXPAND are for only a single 
> > > package.
> > 
> > Past screwups don't justify future screwups.
> 
> I don't see it as a screwup personally.
> 
> It is often useful to have different namespaces for the few general
> flags that control a package's general features and the >9000 flags
> that enable/disable >9000 highly specific plugins.
> 
> And if violation of the rules is useful, perhaps the rules are wrong?

Then perhaps you go and fix the rules instead of ignoring them?

But please also remember to provide the ability to describe those flags
per-package rather than globally, like they are done now. Would be good
to also avoid declaring them globally, like having >50 groups listed in
USE_EXPAND.

When you're done with that, and get all package managers to support it
in a reasonably long stable version, then we can discuss about changing
the rules.

-- 
Best regards,
Michał Górny
<http://dev.gentoo.org/~mgorny/>

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Re: [gentoo-dev] net-misc/strongswan USE_EXPAND

[Jason Zaman]

On Tue, Jun 23, 2015 at 08:05:35AM +0200, Michał Górny wrote:
> Dnia 2015-06-23, o godz. 01:48:58
> Alexandre Rostovtsev <tetromino@gentoo.org> napisał(a):
> 
> > On Tue, 2015-06-23 at 07:06 +0200, Michał Górny wrote:
> > > Dnia 2015-06-23, o godz. 01:23:13
> > > Jason Zaman <jason@perfinion.com> napisał(a):
> > > 
> > > > On Mon, Jun 22, 2015 at 10:55:45PM +0200, Michał Górny wrote:
> > > > > Dnia 2015-06-22, o godz. 16:38:30
> > > > > Jason Zaman <perfinion@gentoo.org> napisał(a):
> > > > > 
> > > > > > Hi all,
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > I want to add STRONGSWAN_PLUGINS to USE_EXPAND. This is related 
> > > > > > to bug
> > > > > > https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=504942
> > > > > > "net-misc/strongswan missing USE flags for plugins"
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > Patrick said to fix it myself, the ebuilds with the plugins 
> > > > > > have
> > > > > > been in the tree for a fair while now and only the USE_EXPAND 
> > > > > > is
> > > > > > missing.
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > If there are no objections, I will commit the following patch 
> > > > > > on friday:
> > > > > 
> > > > > USE_EXPAND is global by its nature. USE flags used by a single 
> > > > > package
> > > > > are not appropriate for making global.
> > > > 
> > > > Since when? There are so many things in USE_EXPAND that are only 
> > > > for a
> > > > single package.
> > > 
> > > Not sure when. But the policies about USE flags were in the devmanual
> > > long before I came here.
> > > 
> > > > APACHE2_MODULES, NGINX_MODULES_HTTP, COLLECTD_PLUGINS, QEMU_*, etc.
> > > > Easily half of the things in USE_EXPAND are for only a single 
> > > > package.
> > > 
> > > Past screwups don't justify future screwups.
> > 
> > I don't see it as a screwup personally.
> > 
> > It is often useful to have different namespaces for the few general
> > flags that control a package's general features and the >9000 flags
> > that enable/disable >9000 highly specific plugins.
> > 
> > And if violation of the rules is useful, perhaps the rules are wrong?
> 
> Then perhaps you go and fix the rules instead of ignoring them?
> 
> But please also remember to provide the ability to describe those flags
> per-package rather than globally, like they are done now. Would be good
> to also avoid declaring them globally, like having >50 groups listed in
> USE_EXPAND.
> 
> When you're done with that, and get all package managers to support it
> in a reasonably long stable version, then we can discuss about changing
> the rules.

I dont quite follow, the useflags are described in the packages
metadata.xml, are not conflicting and are supported by everything.

Is there a rule that everything that is USE_EXPAND'd is a global
useflag? I see no such rule and I dont understand why it would even make
sense. USE_EXPAND arnt useflags, it is just a variable to make useflags
look nicer, they shouldnt all have to be global. What if one and only
one package supports a specific video_card? Should that use-flag be made
global?

Adding use_expand's for foo_plugins makes things a lot easier to manage
and understand tho. The only possible downside I can see is that there
are a lot of entries in it, but we have a lot of useflags so thats hardly
an issue.

-- Jason

Re: [gentoo-dev] net-misc/strongswan USE_EXPAND

[Michał Górny]

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Dnia 2015-06-23, o godz. 10:33:58
Jason Zaman <perfinion@gentoo.org> napisał(a):

> On Tue, Jun 23, 2015 at 08:05:35AM +0200, Michał Górny wrote:
> > Then perhaps you go and fix the rules instead of ignoring them?
> > 
> > But please also remember to provide the ability to describe those flags
> > per-package rather than globally, like they are done now. Would be good
> > to also avoid declaring them globally, like having >50 groups listed in
> > USE_EXPAND.
> > 
> > When you're done with that, and get all package managers to support it
> > in a reasonably long stable version, then we can discuss about changing
> > the rules.
> 
> I dont quite follow, the useflags are described in the packages
> metadata.xml, are not conflicting and are supported by everything.
> 
> Is there a rule that everything that is USE_EXPAND'd is a global
> useflag? I see no such rule and I dont understand why it would even make
> sense. USE_EXPAND arnt useflags, it is just a variable to make useflags
> look nicer, they shouldnt all have to be global. What if one and only
> one package supports a specific video_card? Should that use-flag be made
> global?
> 
> Adding use_expand's for foo_plugins makes things a lot easier to manage
> and understand tho. The only possible downside I can see is that there
> are a lot of entries in it, but we have a lot of useflags so thats hardly
> an issue.

It's not a rule, policy or magic. It's simply how Portage and some
other tools were designed.

You declare USE_EXPAND globally. If you declared it globally but all
flags were local, how would the global declaration really fit?

You describe those flags globally. Sure, there's probably no rule
prohibiting you from describing them via metadata.xml. However, most of
the tools will not expect USE_EXPAND flags to be declared locally. For
a quick test, see 'quse -D radeon' (vs 'quse -D video_cards_radeon').

The recommended way of setting USE_EXPAND flags was via global
make.conf variables so far. Sure, you can override them via
package.use, and even it in a convenient way for a few Portage versions
already, but still the global nature is strongly highlighted. Not that
I like setting anything via make.conf but it's not my decision to make.

-- 
Best regards,
Michał Górny
<http://dev.gentoo.org/~mgorny/>

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Re: [gentoo-dev] net-misc/strongswan USE_EXPAND

[Zac Medico]

On 06/22/2015 10:08 PM, Michał Górny wrote:
> Dnia 2015-06-22, o godz. 14:40:42
> Zac Medico <zmedico@gentoo.org> napisał(a):
> 
>> On 06/22/2015 02:23 PM, Jason Zaman wrote:
>>> On Mon, Jun 22, 2015 at 10:55:45PM +0200, Michał Górny wrote:
>>>> Dnia 2015-06-22, o godz. 16:38:30
>>>> Jason Zaman <perfinion@gentoo.org> napisał(a):
>>>>
>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>
>>>>> I want to add STRONGSWAN_PLUGINS to USE_EXPAND. This is related to bug
>>>>> https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=504942
>>>>> "net-misc/strongswan missing USE flags for plugins"
>>>>>
>>>>> Patrick said to fix it myself, the ebuilds with the plugins have
>>>>> been in the tree for a fair while now and only the USE_EXPAND is
>>>>> missing.
>>>>>
>>>>> If there are no objections, I will commit the following patch on friday:
>>>>
>>>> USE_EXPAND is global by its nature. USE flags used by a single package
>>>> are not appropriate for making global.
>>>
>>> Since when? There are so many things in USE_EXPAND that are only for a
>>> single package.
>>>
>>> APACHE2_MODULES, NGINX_MODULES_HTTP, COLLECTD_PLUGINS, QEMU_*, etc.
>>> Easily half of the things in USE_EXPAND are for only a single package.
>>>
>>> -- Jason
>>>
>>
>> Last time this came up, I suggested that we introduce a generic PLUGINS
>> USE_EXPAND than many packages could utilize. That way, the plugins are
>> still distinguished from the other flags in IUSE, but we don't have to
>> introduce a new USE_EXPAND for every package.
> 
> Soo... plugins.desc would describe plugins to a lot of different
> packages? Like:
> 
> foo - [in bar] Support for libfoo, [in baz] does something a bit
> different
> 

We have support for local use descriptions in each package's
metadata.xml, and profiles/use.local.desc is generated from those
automatically.
-- 
Thanks,
Zac