[gentoo-dev] Lifting the HOMEPAGE requirement for ebuilds

[gentoo-dev] Lifting the HOMEPAGE requirement for ebuilds

[Michał Górny]

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Hello,

Right now an attempt to commit an ebuild with no HOMEPAGE results in:

  HOMEPAGE.missing              1
   app-admin/eselect-sh/eselect-sh-0.4.ebuild

Note: use --include-dev (-d) to check dependencies for 'dev' profiles

Please fix these important QA issues first.

Why is this considered an 'important QA issue'? Does the policy really
say that if something doesn't have a homepage, we're supposed to put
garbage in there?

-- 
Best regards,
Michał Górny

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[gentoo-dev] Re: Lifting the HOMEPAGE requirement for ebuilds

[Duncan]

Michał Górny posted on Sun, 13 Jan 2013 15:24:02 +0100 as excerpted:

> Hello,
> 
> Right now an attempt to commit an ebuild with no HOMEPAGE results in:
> 
>   HOMEPAGE.missing              1
>    app-admin/eselect-sh/eselect-sh-0.4.ebuild
> 
> Note: use --include-dev (-d) to check dependencies for 'dev' profiles
> 
> Please fix these important QA issues first.
> 
> Why is this considered an 'important QA issue'? Does the policy really
> say that if something doesn't have a homepage, we're supposed to put
> garbage in there?

How does something not have a homepage?  If upstream is gone, then by 
definition, gentoo's the "upstream" as we're distributing it, so 
gentoo.org becomes the homepage.

(I've always thought there should be a special page for this purpose on 
the gentoo site, more or less like the package version of a 404 error, 
explaining that for this package upstream is dead, so as the distributor, 
we're now the homepage, that would distinguish this case from proper 
gentoo projects and avoid this question coming up occasionally as it 
seems to, but...)

-- 
Duncan - List replies preferred.   No HTML msgs.
"Every nonfree program has a lord, a master --
and if you use the program, he is your master."  Richard Stallman

Re: [gentoo-dev] Lifting the HOMEPAGE requirement for ebuilds

[hasufell]

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Hash: SHA1

On 01/13/2013 03:24 PM, Michał Górny wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> Right now an attempt to commit an ebuild with no HOMEPAGE results
> in:
> 
> HOMEPAGE.missing              1 
> app-admin/eselect-sh/eselect-sh-0.4.ebuild
> 
> Note: use --include-dev (-d) to check dependencies for 'dev'
> profiles
> 
> Please fix these important QA issues first.
> 
> Why is this considered an 'important QA issue'? Does the policy
> really say that if something doesn't have a homepage, we're
> supposed to put garbage in there?
> 


That is already lifted:
https://dev.gentoo.org/~ulm/pms/head/pms.html#x1-660007.2

seems to be a repoman bug or just not yet implemented
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Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Lifting the HOMEPAGE requirement for ebuilds

[Michał Górny]

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On Sun, 13 Jan 2013 17:33:27 +0000 (UTC)
Duncan <1i5t5.duncan@cox.net> wrote:

> Michał Górny posted on Sun, 13 Jan 2013 15:24:02 +0100 as excerpted:
> 
> > Hello,
> > 
> > Right now an attempt to commit an ebuild with no HOMEPAGE results in:
> > 
> >   HOMEPAGE.missing              1
> >    app-admin/eselect-sh/eselect-sh-0.4.ebuild
> > 
> > Note: use --include-dev (-d) to check dependencies for 'dev' profiles
> > 
> > Please fix these important QA issues first.
> > 
> > Why is this considered an 'important QA issue'? Does the policy really
> > say that if something doesn't have a homepage, we're supposed to put
> > garbage in there?
> 
> How does something not have a homepage?  If upstream is gone, then by 
> definition, gentoo's the "upstream" as we're distributing it, so 
> gentoo.org becomes the homepage.

If something is a six-liner made by Gentoo and for Gentoo, noone cares
enough to create a homepage for it.

http://gentoo.org is the most useless 'homepage' value you can use. It
doesn't mean anything, and especially you aren't going to find a piece
of information on the software on that site.

In that case, even https://bugs.gentoo.org is more useful.

-- 
Best regards,
Michał Górny

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Lifting the HOMEPAGE requirement for ebuilds

[Zac Medico]

On 01/13/2013 09:43 AM, hasufell wrote:
> On 01/13/2013 03:24 PM, Michał Górny wrote:
>> Hello,
> 
>> Right now an attempt to commit an ebuild with no HOMEPAGE results
>> in:
> 
>> HOMEPAGE.missing              1 
>> app-admin/eselect-sh/eselect-sh-0.4.ebuild
> 
>> Note: use --include-dev (-d) to check dependencies for 'dev'
>> profiles
> 
>> Please fix these important QA issues first.
> 
>> Why is this considered an 'important QA issue'? Does the policy
>> really say that if something doesn't have a homepage, we're
>> supposed to put garbage in there?
> 
> 
> 
> That is already lifted:
> https://dev.gentoo.org/~ulm/pms/head/pms.html#x1-660007.2
> 
> seems to be a repoman bug or just not yet implemented

repoman is intended to enforce policies, which can be stricter than pms.
So, the question is, what is our policy going to be?
-- 
Thanks,
Zac

Re: [gentoo-dev] Lifting the HOMEPAGE requirement for ebuilds

[hasufell]

On 01/13/2013 07:03 PM, Zac Medico wrote:
> On 01/13/2013 09:43 AM, hasufell wrote:
>> On 01/13/2013 03:24 PM, Michał Górny wrote:
>>> Hello,
>>
>>> Right now an attempt to commit an ebuild with no HOMEPAGE results
>>> in:
>>
>>> HOMEPAGE.missing              1 
>>> app-admin/eselect-sh/eselect-sh-0.4.ebuild
>>
>>> Note: use --include-dev (-d) to check dependencies for 'dev'
>>> profiles
>>
>>> Please fix these important QA issues first.
>>
>>> Why is this considered an 'important QA issue'? Does the policy
>>> really say that if something doesn't have a homepage, we're
>>> supposed to put garbage in there?
>>
>>
>>
>> That is already lifted:
>> https://dev.gentoo.org/~ulm/pms/head/pms.html#x1-660007.2
>>
>> seems to be a repoman bug or just not yet implemented
> 
> repoman is intended to enforce policies, which can be stricter than pms.
> So, the question is, what is our policy going to be?


+1 to allow empty/missing HOMEPAGE variable

dead homepage => useless
http://gentoo.org => useless
https://bugs.gentoo.org => too obvious

Re: [gentoo-dev] Lifting the HOMEPAGE requirement for ebuilds

[Mike Frysinger]

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On Sunday 13 January 2013 09:24:02 Michał Górny wrote:
> Right now an attempt to commit an ebuild with no HOMEPAGE results in:
> 
>   HOMEPAGE.missing              1
>    app-admin/eselect-sh/eselect-sh-0.4.ebuild

use the common eselect homepage ? http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/eselect/
-mike

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Lifting the HOMEPAGE requirement for ebuilds

[Michał Górny]

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On Sun, 13 Jan 2013 13:27:02 -0500
Mike Frysinger <vapier@gentoo.org> wrote:

> On Sunday 13 January 2013 09:24:02 Michał Górny wrote:
> > Right now an attempt to commit an ebuild with no HOMEPAGE results in:
> > 
> >   HOMEPAGE.missing              1
> >    app-admin/eselect-sh/eselect-sh-0.4.ebuild
> 
> use the common eselect homepage ? http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/eselect/

How is it meaningful? It would suggest people to look for something
there... and there's nothing about eselect-sh there.

If the only purpose of HOMEPAGE is to put something semi-related there,
I think it should be renamed to SEMIRANDOMURI.

-- 
Best regards,
Michał Górny

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Lifting the HOMEPAGE requirement for ebuilds

[Mike Frysinger]

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On Sunday 13 January 2013 13:27:44 Michał Górny wrote:
> On Sun, 13 Jan 2013 13:27:02 -0500
> 
> Mike Frysinger <vapier@gentoo.org> wrote:
> > On Sunday 13 January 2013 09:24:02 Michał Górny wrote:
> > > Right now an attempt to commit an ebuild with no HOMEPAGE results in:
> > >   HOMEPAGE.missing              1
> > >   
> > >    app-admin/eselect-sh/eselect-sh-0.4.ebuild
> > 
> > use the common eselect homepage ? http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/eselect/
> 
> How is it meaningful? It would suggest people to look for something
> there... and there's nothing about eselect-sh there.
> 
> If the only purpose of HOMEPAGE is to put something semi-related there,
> I think it should be renamed to SEMIRANDOMURI.

have you actually read the page ?  there is general eselect guides and 
overviews.

conversely, i install "eselect-sh" and then what ?  it provides absolutely no 
documentation -- an "sh.eselect" file with no information as how to use it.
-mike

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Lifting the HOMEPAGE requirement for ebuilds

[Michael Orlitzky]

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On 01/13/2013 12:58 PM, Michał Górny wrote:
> 
> If something is a six-liner made by Gentoo and for Gentoo, noone
> cares enough to create a homepage for it.
> 
> http://gentoo.org is the most useless 'homepage' value you can use.
> It doesn't mean anything, and especially you aren't going to find a
> piece of information on the software on that site.
> 
> In that case, even https://bugs.gentoo.org is more useful.
> 

My most common use for the HOMEPAGE is when I'm looking through eix
output wondering "WTF does this do?" So I visit the homepage to find out.

Even for a six-line script, you should have the time to essentially
`echo README > index.html` and upload it somewhere. This at least lets
people click on the URL, see what the package does, and find out where
to report bugs.
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Re: [gentoo-dev] Lifting the HOMEPAGE requirement for ebuilds

[Michał Górny]

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On Sun, 13 Jan 2013 13:33:49 -0500
Mike Frysinger <vapier@gentoo.org> wrote:

> On Sunday 13 January 2013 13:27:44 Michał Górny wrote:
> > On Sun, 13 Jan 2013 13:27:02 -0500
> > 
> > Mike Frysinger <vapier@gentoo.org> wrote:
> > > On Sunday 13 January 2013 09:24:02 Michał Górny wrote:
> > > > Right now an attempt to commit an ebuild with no HOMEPAGE results in:
> > > >   HOMEPAGE.missing              1
> > > >   
> > > >    app-admin/eselect-sh/eselect-sh-0.4.ebuild
> > > 
> > > use the common eselect homepage ? http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/eselect/
> > 
> > How is it meaningful? It would suggest people to look for something
> > there... and there's nothing about eselect-sh there.
> > 
> > If the only purpose of HOMEPAGE is to put something semi-related there,
> > I think it should be renamed to SEMIRANDOMURI.
> 
> have you actually read the page ?  there is general eselect guides and 
> overviews.
> 
> conversely, i install "eselect-sh" and then what ?  it provides absolutely no 
> documentation -- an "sh.eselect" file with no information as how to use it.

Ok, that is an argument.

-- 
Best regards,
Michał Górny

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Lifting the HOMEPAGE requirement for ebuilds

[Ulrich Mueller]

>>>>> On Sun, 13 Jan 2013, Michał Górny wrote:

>> How does something not have a homepage?  If upstream is gone, then by 
>> definition, gentoo's the "upstream" as we're distributing it, so 
>> gentoo.org becomes the homepage.

> If something is a six-liner made by Gentoo and for Gentoo, noone cares
> enough to create a homepage for it.

Then you could use your project page, or the gitweb of the repo.
Or create a wiki page, this doesn't take more than ten minutes.

> http://gentoo.org is the most useless 'homepage' value you can use. It
> doesn't mean anything, and especially you aren't going to find a piece
> of information on the software on that site.

It is still better than leaving the field empty, even if its only
meaning is "Gentoo is upstream for this package." And I'm sure that in
most cases a better homepage can be found.

Ulrich

Re: [gentoo-dev] Lifting the HOMEPAGE requirement for ebuilds

[Markos Chandras]

On 13 January 2013 18:06, hasufell <hasufell@gentoo.org> wrote:
> On 01/13/2013 07:03 PM, Zac Medico wrote:
>> On 01/13/2013 09:43 AM, hasufell wrote:
>>> On 01/13/2013 03:24 PM, Michał Górny wrote:
>>>> Hello,
>>>
>>>> Right now an attempt to commit an ebuild with no HOMEPAGE results
>>>> in:
>>>
>>>> HOMEPAGE.missing              1
>>>> app-admin/eselect-sh/eselect-sh-0.4.ebuild
>>>
>>>> Note: use --include-dev (-d) to check dependencies for 'dev'
>>>> profiles
>>>
>>>> Please fix these important QA issues first.
>>>
>>>> Why is this considered an 'important QA issue'? Does the policy
>>>> really say that if something doesn't have a homepage, we're
>>>> supposed to put garbage in there?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> That is already lifted:
>>> https://dev.gentoo.org/~ulm/pms/head/pms.html#x1-660007.2
>>>
>>> seems to be a repoman bug or just not yet implemented
>>
>> repoman is intended to enforce policies, which can be stricter than pms.
>> So, the question is, what is our policy going to be?
>
>
> +1 to allow empty/missing HOMEPAGE variable
>
> dead homepage => useless
> http://gentoo.org => useless
> https://bugs.gentoo.org => too obvious
>

An empty homepage usually means the package is dead. I'd rather see
the cvs/git/svn url being used as HOMEPAGE in case your tiny little
script has no proj page at all.

-- 
Regards,
Markos Chandras / Gentoo Linux Developer / Key ID: B4AFF2C2

Re: [gentoo-dev] Lifting the HOMEPAGE requirement for ebuilds

[hasufell]

On 01/14/2013 11:06 AM, Markos Chandras wrote:
> On 13 January 2013 18:06, hasufell <hasufell@gentoo.org> wrote:
>> On 01/13/2013 07:03 PM, Zac Medico wrote:
>>> On 01/13/2013 09:43 AM, hasufell wrote:
>>>> On 01/13/2013 03:24 PM, Michał Górny wrote:
>>>>> Hello,
>>>>
>>>>> Right now an attempt to commit an ebuild with no HOMEPAGE results
>>>>> in:
>>>>
>>>>> HOMEPAGE.missing              1
>>>>> app-admin/eselect-sh/eselect-sh-0.4.ebuild
>>>>
>>>>> Note: use --include-dev (-d) to check dependencies for 'dev'
>>>>> profiles
>>>>
>>>>> Please fix these important QA issues first.
>>>>
>>>>> Why is this considered an 'important QA issue'? Does the policy
>>>>> really say that if something doesn't have a homepage, we're
>>>>> supposed to put garbage in there?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> That is already lifted:
>>>> https://dev.gentoo.org/~ulm/pms/head/pms.html#x1-660007.2
>>>>
>>>> seems to be a repoman bug or just not yet implemented
>>>
>>> repoman is intended to enforce policies, which can be stricter than pms.
>>> So, the question is, what is our policy going to be?
>>
>>
>> +1 to allow empty/missing HOMEPAGE variable
>>
>> dead homepage => useless
>> http://gentoo.org => useless
>> https://bugs.gentoo.org => too obvious
>>
> 
> An empty homepage usually means the package is dead. I'd rather see
> the cvs/git/svn url being used as HOMEPAGE in case your tiny little
> script has no proj page at all.
> 

No, an empty homepage just means upstream is dead. There are numerous
examples of years old packages still working fine without a single update.

Re: [gentoo-dev] Lifting the HOMEPAGE requirement for ebuilds

[Pacho Ramos]

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El lun, 14-01-2013 a las 18:15 +0100, hasufell escribió:
[...]
> >> +1 to allow empty/missing HOMEPAGE variable
> >>
> >> dead homepage => useless
> >> http://gentoo.org => useless
> >> https://bugs.gentoo.org => too obvious
> >>
> > 
> > An empty homepage usually means the package is dead. I'd rather see
> > the cvs/git/svn url being used as HOMEPAGE in case your tiny little
> > script has no proj page at all.
> > 
> 
> No, an empty homepage just means upstream is dead. There are numerous
> examples of years old packages still working fine without a single update.
> 
> 

Other option is to use "gentoo.org" as HOMEPAGE for that packages (as
some of them are already doing). But, since people think it's useless,
why not use as HOMEPAGE
http://sources.gentoo.org/cgi-bin/viewvc.cgi/gentoo-x86/...
?

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Lifting the HOMEPAGE requirement for ebuilds

[Ian Stakenvicius]

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Hash: SHA256

On 14/01/13 03:15 PM, Pacho Ramos wrote:
> El lun, 14-01-2013 a las 18:15 +0100, hasufell escribió: [...]
>>>> +1 to allow empty/missing HOMEPAGE variable
>>>> 
>>>> dead homepage => useless http://gentoo.org => useless 
>>>> https://bugs.gentoo.org => too obvious
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> An empty homepage usually means the package is dead. I'd rather
>>> see the cvs/git/svn url being used as HOMEPAGE in case your
>>> tiny little script has no proj page at all.
>>> 
>> 
>> No, an empty homepage just means upstream is dead. There are
>> numerous examples of years old packages still working fine
>> without a single update.
>> 
>> 
> 
> Other option is to use "gentoo.org" as HOMEPAGE for that packages
> (as some of them are already doing). But, since people think it's
> useless, why not use as HOMEPAGE 
> http://sources.gentoo.org/cgi-bin/viewvc.cgi/gentoo-x86/... ?

Or what about a URL to a wiki.gentoo.org page for dead upstream packages?

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Lifting the HOMEPAGE requirement for ebuilds

[Pacho Ramos]

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El lun, 14-01-2013 a las 15:49 -0500, Ian Stakenvicius escribió:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA256
> 
> On 14/01/13 03:15 PM, Pacho Ramos wrote:
> > El lun, 14-01-2013 a las 18:15 +0100, hasufell escribió: [...]
> >>>> +1 to allow empty/missing HOMEPAGE variable
> >>>> 
> >>>> dead homepage => useless http://gentoo.org => useless 
> >>>> https://bugs.gentoo.org => too obvious
> >>>> 
> >>> 
> >>> An empty homepage usually means the package is dead. I'd rather
> >>> see the cvs/git/svn url being used as HOMEPAGE in case your
> >>> tiny little script has no proj page at all.
> >>> 
> >> 
> >> No, an empty homepage just means upstream is dead. There are
> >> numerous examples of years old packages still working fine
> >> without a single update.
> >> 
> >> 
> > 
> > Other option is to use "gentoo.org" as HOMEPAGE for that packages
> > (as some of them are already doing). But, since people think it's
> > useless, why not use as HOMEPAGE 
> > http://sources.gentoo.org/cgi-bin/viewvc.cgi/gentoo-x86/... ?
> 
> Or what about a URL to a wiki.gentoo.org page for dead upstream packages?

Well, the advantage of using sources.gentoo.org is that people will find
there patches and stuff related with the package :/

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Lifting the HOMEPAGE requirement for ebuilds

[Mike Frysinger]

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On Monday 14 January 2013 15:15:03 Pacho Ramos wrote:
> El lun, 14-01-2013 a las 18:15 +0100, hasufell escribió:
> [...]
> 
> > >> +1 to allow empty/missing HOMEPAGE variable
> > >> 
> > >> dead homepage => useless
> > >> http://gentoo.org => useless
> > >> https://bugs.gentoo.org => too obvious
> > > 
> > > An empty homepage usually means the package is dead. I'd rather see
> > > the cvs/git/svn url being used as HOMEPAGE in case your tiny little
> > > script has no proj page at all.
> > 
> > No, an empty homepage just means upstream is dead. There are numerous
> > examples of years old packages still working fine without a single
> > update.
> 
> Other option is to use "gentoo.org" as HOMEPAGE for that packages (as
> some of them are already doing). But, since people think it's useless,
> why not use as HOMEPAGE
> http://sources.gentoo.org/cgi-bin/viewvc.cgi/gentoo-x86/...
> ?

semi-related, drop that intermediate noise.
	http://sources.gentoo.org/${CATEGORY}/${PN}/
it'll redirect to the right place
-mike

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