From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org ([208.92.234.80] helo=lists.gentoo.org) by finch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1SiP5q-0001N7-Cb for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Sat, 23 Jun 2012 12:05:35 +0000 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 06CF9E07AF; Sat, 23 Jun 2012 12:05:00 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-wi0-f181.google.com (mail-wi0-f181.google.com [209.85.212.181]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D3165E0AA8 for ; Sat, 23 Jun 2012 12:03:41 +0000 (UTC) Received: by wibhn14 with SMTP id hn14so1197742wib.10 for ; Sat, 23 Jun 2012 05:03:41 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlemail.com; s=20120113; h=date:from:to:subject:message-id:in-reply-to:references:x-mailer :mime-version:content-type; bh=h/Tm6u0sy7goZPwbnDSXGxflsZMTXGDIybwJMo95tPU=; b=juKX0FKDeNSUWL+Zlu0vqqqHW+34mf/uZv3Njvsp8ZbfvKtOkrBwUoFSC+Zv8o1apK sTK/UONGZ4sQcEGj8lQ1O9K5yXmIyBQALA57ZnMTbkURaNlv8U43mROIoKlPBWx4m9MW eIRmkEsJVF0irzknoXlGwTXArFc5KsCHpVJg1sUrn7+PgAlVIUi3JleCv30zvYFBtRpD fJXtYq06hz7vCgPF+CE/1A1lj9wC5m65ARqqQnv1Gjh+RbCq2zcZD0wW7uYN16MbrpoP ebp6QqtHMtDaEdU8DB3UvO4Rh/Z8y/+LmUhRr17M9Dho4dn0qdJ0+gGzT/0paKif3jKe W50g== Received: by 10.216.131.223 with SMTP id m73mr3158313wei.76.1340453020974; Sat, 23 Jun 2012 05:03:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (cpc13-broo7-2-0-cust130.14-2.cable.virginmedia.com. [82.9.16.131]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id gc6sm3099885wib.0.2012.06.23.05.03.39 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Sat, 23 Jun 2012 05:03:40 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2012 12:59:42 +0100 From: Ciaran McCreesh To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] My wishlist for EAPI 5 Message-ID: <20120623125942.4a743f69@googlemail.com> In-Reply-To: <20120623115224.2693.qmail@stuge.se> References: <20120621083945.345d661a@googlemail.com> <1340438017.5979.11.camel@belkin4> <20120623103833.6b9cb91e@googlemail.com> <20120623095326.25423.qmail@stuge.se> <1340447072.5979.33.camel@belkin4> <20120623113125.656d26c4@googlemail.com> <1340449551.5979.43.camel@belkin4> <20120623121422.6d47683a@googlemail.com> <20120623113809.1641.qmail@stuge.se> <20120623123759.03d19277@googlemail.com> <20120623115224.2693.qmail@stuge.se> X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.8.0 (GTK+ 2.24.10; x86_64-pc-linux-gnu) Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=PGP-SHA1; boundary="Sig_/.l967Hvw3=leqGdeSLUA=bt"; protocol="application/pgp-signature" X-Archives-Salt: 6864b436-cf22-4fcd-abec-d15c4ac43407 X-Archives-Hash: 9a88f6164e2a20790cf08c933b4402e4 --Sig_/.l967Hvw3=leqGdeSLUA=bt Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sat, 23 Jun 2012 13:52:24 +0200 Peter Stuge wrote: > Ciaran McCreesh wrote: > > bring this to the point where we can say something other than > > "huh?". >=20 > You can accelerate by making one guess about each thing on the list > and asking for confirmation of your guess. >=20 > It sounds silly, but I realized that this actually happens all the > time offline - at least to me. I interpret, ask if I got it right, > then move on. It's pretty efficient, but requires both sender and > receiver wanting successful transmission. The issue is not that we don't understand the list. The issue is that we don't understand the problem (beyond superficially), how the proposed solution works from an ebuild perspective, whether the solution solves the problem, or how it all fits together. Most of the stuff on the list is irrelevant from a design perspective. It's not that the list is hard to understand, it's that understanding the problem and solution requires completely different material. To take one example, figuring out exactly which variables get mangled is an unimportant detail at this stage (and likely we'll want to offload it to profiles, not hard-code it in PMS) and not a central part of the proposal. What we need is a GLEP, describing it in high level terms with a discussion upon how it impacts users and ebuild developers, and a PMS patch, highlighting what's to be changed in specific technical terms. --=20 Ciaran McCreesh --Sig_/.l967Hvw3=leqGdeSLUA=bt Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.19 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAk/lr7cACgkQ96zL6DUtXhEzUgCcCex96sx/d6lZqj61eNjjvcLO RRoAoNgUd8e5ZNo1ZEag1vukBNeGfLVt =6FVT -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig_/.l967Hvw3=leqGdeSLUA=bt--