From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org ([208.92.234.80] helo=lists.gentoo.org) by finch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1RiVY9-0007nr-8Q for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2012 18:26:57 +0000 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 962D621C198; Wed, 4 Jan 2012 18:26:43 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mx10.schiffbauer.net (mx10.schiffbauer.net [188.40.110.137]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 77A1A21C039 for ; Wed, 4 Jan 2012 18:26:13 +0000 (UTC) Received: from cl-936.ham-02.de.sixxs.net ([2001:6f8:1c00:3a7::2]:54472 helo=lisa.schiffbauer.net) by mx10.schiffbauer.net with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1RiVXP-0007jx-Hm for gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2012 19:26:12 +0100 Received: from mschiff by lisa.schiffbauer.net with local (Exim 4.77) (envelope-from ) id 1RiVXJ-0001Ng-Vz for gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2012 19:26:06 +0100 Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2012 19:26:05 +0100 From: Marc Schiffbauer To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] rfc: locations of binaries and separate /usr Message-ID: <20120104182605.GF30764@lisa.schiffbauer.lan> Mail-Followup-To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org References: <20120103212215.GU780@gentoo.org> <20120103230918.GA7247@linux1> <4F03A1AA.6070205@gentoo.org> <20120104091743.0e1cd91a@pomiocik.lan> <4F0440B3.4090500@gentoo.org> <20120104163734.07439f2b@pomiocik.lan> <20120104163315.GV780@gentoo.org> <20120104174742.11d7002d@pomiocik.lan> <20228.34930.732592.657243@a1i15.kph.uni-mainz.de> <1325698374.22213.10.camel@TesterBox.tester.ca> Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="AqsLC8rIMeq19msA" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <1325698374.22213.10.camel@TesterBox.tester.ca> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) X-Virus-Scanned: by ClamAV (http://www.clamav.org) X-Spam-Score: -2.6 X-Spam-Level: -- X-Archives-Salt: a6fe257d-dd3d-4744-accf-f18e8913bfb7 X-Archives-Hash: b1f4a5c0f980cdb19d3a8e37d926912f --AqsLC8rIMeq19msA Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable * Olivier Cr=C3=AAte schrieb am 04.01.12 um 18:32 Uhr: > On Wed, 2012-01-04 at 18:12 +0100, Ulrich Mueller wrote: > > >>>>> On Wed, 4 Jan 2012, Micha=C5=82 G=C3=B3rny wrote: > >=20 > > >> What mistakes? > >=20 > > > The mistake of introducing a pointless separation based on a rule of > > > thumb which becomes more and more blurry over time, and hacking > > > packages just to make it work. > >=20 > > There's really nothing pointless or blurry about this separation. > > The FHS has a nice definition: "The contents of the root filesystem > > must be adequate to boot, restore, recover, and/or repair the system." >=20 > The problem is that to boot a modern system, you need a shitload of > stuff.=20 To boot the system on its highest level: yes. But Linux/UNIX systems have a concept called runlevels that can perfectly cover cases where this "shitload of stuff" is not required. For example, to make that FHS definition be reality there are (can be) runlevels that will only boot a system with all basic stuff required to mount the rootfs and make root being able to login to the local text console. These are the things that make a unixoid system valuable over other kind of systems. > For example, modern network filesystems often have secure > authentication and probably LDAP too, so that means we need to move ldap > and openssl into / and all the dependencies. Also, anything that > installs a udev rule needs to be in /, and the list goes on an on. Very > soon, you have almost everything in /... You do not need everything to make a system boot some sort of recovery-console for example. >=20 > This rule made sense in the 80s, but it doesn't match the modern world > anymore. Why? The benefits to keep a system bootable and repairable is one of the reasons why unix systems are more robust or can better be repeaired than, lets say windows systems for example. I do not like the idea to throw away all those benefits just because so many (younger/newer) people do not know about the possibilities an "old fashioned" unix system tends to have. -Marc --=20 8AAC 5F46 83B4 DB70 8317 3723 296C 6CCA 35A6 4134 --AqsLC8rIMeq19msA Content-Type: application/pgp-signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.17 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFPBJm9KWxsyjWmQTQRApCYAKCIMmLPSNbFperDItwQbtqpGfXQ+gCdHUw/ MpgptWsJ5KxMWxPQXCHDp78= =hNV8 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --AqsLC8rIMeq19msA--