From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org ([208.92.234.80] helo=lists.gentoo.org) by finch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1RhAnB-0006nb-Sk for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Sun, 01 Jan 2012 02:04:58 +0000 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id A952D21C045; Sun, 1 Jan 2012 02:04:43 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-gy0-f181.google.com (mail-gy0-f181.google.com [209.85.160.181]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 97AD021C030 for ; Sun, 1 Jan 2012 02:04:08 +0000 (UTC) Received: by ghrr19 with SMTP id r19so5771158ghr.40 for ; Sat, 31 Dec 2011 18:04:08 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=sender:date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id:mail-followup-to :mime-version:content-type:content-disposition:user-agent; bh=enLvZ/eE1ajLZ8GBetKRXV+ikf4kd5KVa60pSWnPWDw=; b=sfrL3qyLUO7xrZJmdAZy2Pg7BleNlmPnf6Csdk3iEb8M+m/MlfgdOmy4eOK5MyNIY3 PYyKge46/1/sSsB6EQ4PiBK1G9fyoN8LvuR/rkkcw/G04LWdo4Nz7nqVISjnO7lJCUEh WSFbgM8znA+0xXVBJ2OxLOKPDFbTUMe/IiIeg= Received: by 10.236.192.229 with SMTP id i65mr15012128yhn.4.1325383448117; Sat, 31 Dec 2011 18:04:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from linux1 (cpe-76-187-77-158.tx.res.rr.com. [76.187.77.158]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id h11sm12958761and.21.2011.12.31.18.04.06 (version=SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Sat, 31 Dec 2011 18:04:07 -0800 (PST) Sender: William Hubbs Received: by linux1 (sSMTP sendmail emulation); Sat, 31 Dec 2011 19:59:47 -0600 Date: Sat, 31 Dec 2011 19:59:47 -0600 From: William Hubbs To: gentoo development Cc: robbat2@gentoo.org Subject: [gentoo-dev] rfc: locations of binaries and separate /usr Message-ID: <20120101015947.GA9914@linux1> Mail-Followup-To: gentoo development , robbat2@gentoo.org Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="45Z9DzgjV8m4Oswq" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) X-Archives-Salt: fcd92c27-916c-4703-a8dc-e3a2cfbcf0af X-Archives-Hash: c3c5bdabbe058b08627ff04cee896af3 --45Z9DzgjV8m4Oswq Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline All, a significant change is taking place with several upstreams that will affect us in gentoo, so I wanted to bring it to the list for discussion. Udev, kmod (which is a replacement for module-init-tools which will be needed by >=udev-176), systemd, and soon others, are advocating a major change to the locations where binaries and libraries are stored on linux systems. The goal is to deprecate /bin, /lib, /sbin and /usr/sbin. My understanding is that they want to move software that is installed in /bin, /sbin and /usr/sbin to /usr/bin. Also, they want to move everything from /lib to /usr/lib. I have been working with robbat2 on solutions to the separate /usr issue (That is why I have specifically cc'd him on this email) which will allow people to not use an initramfs. If we migrate everything off of the root fs to /usr, all of those solutions become moot. On the other hand, if we don't migrate, we run the risk of eventually having our default configuration not supported by upstream. I see three options: 1) Start migrating packages along with upstream and have everyone who has a separate /usr (including me by the way) start using an initramfs of some kind, either dracut or one that we generate specifically for gentoo. The reason I suggest the initramfs, is, unfortunately if we migrate everything, nothing else would work. 2) Combine the sbin and bin directories both on the root filesystem and in /usr by moving things from /sbin to /bin and /usr/sbin to /usr/bin. 3) Try to maintain things the way they are as long as possible. Whether or not I like what is happening personally, I think we should consider the first option, because I think it will get more and more difficult for us to do anything else over time. And we will eventually find ourselves not supported by upstreams. Please discuss; I want to hear what you think. William --45Z9DzgjV8m4Oswq Content-Type: application/pgp-signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.17 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAk7/vhMACgkQblQW9DDEZTjyrgCgjOif68KVyd5V4owXulIucNW4 QEcAn3EmH2z3CceCEHkWbNWUb4R82Sn5 =4308 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --45Z9DzgjV8m4Oswq--