From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org ([208.92.234.80] helo=lists.gentoo.org) by finch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1Oi41g-0003FU-D9 for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Sun, 08 Aug 2010 11:26:48 +0000 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id C50C4E087F; Sun, 8 Aug 2010 11:26:45 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-ew0-f53.google.com (mail-ew0-f53.google.com [209.85.215.53]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 38734E086A for ; Sun, 8 Aug 2010 11:26:36 +0000 (UTC) Received: by ewy19 with SMTP id 19so4041262ewy.40 for ; Sun, 08 Aug 2010 04:26:35 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:sender:date:from:to:subject :message-id:references:mime-version:content-type:content-disposition :in-reply-to:user-agent; bh=ybH3Tnq1gWuaFkv8axMb6zFmZVUNAqVCfHjn4R8T6dI=; b=MfnMpixJ5IOXbJtx//261tR8G265CatVEypxaCl7tSiEyA6561nIjKJswV6HOJJcMh bYB62uz4zo1xZzzwYicH/4meYz5qCWYPSJoyb7eNbaIN07cXs+DDv8++TbX/M524b/2J HEKZ7dWszEEDleKTz2Rr2miaAS1E+dLjOL/lo= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=sender:date:from:to:subject:message-id:references:mime-version :content-type:content-disposition:in-reply-to:user-agent; b=vG1JfsMNgOKu56lywc6DpBQqL9jD8bt1QcTRpDYbHrm6UKCr1dsGzyJBJ45+siOOs2 Hq9ANq/lbdJ/3rYVWK16TDxUvLXCvUKQMIJb3NXtJ/RUBWkZCIHLhUdmAi2Ha7+iMvmS qlfIFFmyeJ+Vm3/kHmCuC5aHRuerpfY9HSp7E= Received: by 10.213.28.194 with SMTP id n2mr10926173ebc.16.1281266794653; Sun, 08 Aug 2010 04:26:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Mystical (178.128.28.78.dsl.dyn.forthnet.gr [178.128.28.78]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id v8sm5859884eeh.8.2010.08.08.04.26.33 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Sun, 08 Aug 2010 04:26:33 -0700 (PDT) Sender: Markos Chandras Date: Sun, 8 Aug 2010 14:27:14 +0300 From: Markos Chandras To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] net-proxy/squid needs your love Message-ID: <20100808112714.GC12722@Mystical> References: <20100804115055.GA15984@Eternity> <4C599162.7050001@gentoo.org> <20100804173457.GB19427@Mystical> <4C59A7B8.6070208@gentoo.org> <20100806225419.GA3436@Mystical> <4C5E8FCB.8050905@gentoo.org> Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="HG+GLK89HZ1zG0kk" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <4C5E8FCB.8050905@gentoo.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.20 (2009-06-14) X-Archives-Salt: 0e91fdce-c420-4934-82cd-bac8b470ea4a X-Archives-Hash: 31521eaadada1af42bfa75d109dd3faa --HG+GLK89HZ1zG0kk Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sun, Aug 08, 2010 at 11:06:51AM +0000, Jorge Manuel B. S. Vicetto wrote: > >> > > The inactivity of many herds most of the time blocks the work of some o= ther > > herds. Isn't council's responsibility to step up and resolve these > > interproject issues? It shouldn't be that difficult to ask for monthly = project > > status updates ( A simple "Yes, we are alive but slow kthxbye" would be > > sufficient, just to know that somebody is actually listening to that e-= mail > > alias after all ), discuss this on Council's monthly meetings ( Shouldn= 't it take=20 > > more than 20' if you already have the status updates on your Inbox ) an= d decide whether > > you should prune these herds or not. IMHO undertakers cannot handle the= load > > atm but council can. >=20 > The issue to me is not council inquiring about projects / herds status, > but the aftermath of that. Some people argue that the council should be > able to close projects and or reform our structure. I don't like that > for the reasons I've stated on my manifesto. > About the montly updates check my above note about the cron jobs. > One thing that has been raised and I think we can already do, is to have > someone (who? - I'd suggest a reformed metastructure project) follow the > yearly projects elections and report them on a global page about teams > and leads. Another option would be to have the elections team publish > all results under its project space. I really really really doubt that most of our projects run yearly elections. Instead of having one person following every project status updates, make t= he project leads sending reports to e.g. gentoo-project ML about status update= s. Something like [Qt project]: 4 active, 15 inactive members, elections two months ago, we need more manpower is sufficient. Posting such reports on public ML will help users to track down project needs and step up and help = if needed. If we have enough manpower we can have a global page as well > As GLEP39 already mandates on its specification[4] that all projects > "must occur at least once every 12 months", we can have the > metastructure project report any cases where that doesn't happen to the > dev ml. What should happen after that is something I think the project > needs to address. I'd prefer to have it done in the reform of GLEP39 > process. Sure but you need to give this project powerzzzz to smash down any project that fails to report its status as well.=20 >=20 > > Furthermore this inactivity ( as I said before ) doesn't look that good= at all > > to our user community . Moreover it seems like dead herds don't even > > bother to ask for help or "hire" more proxy maintainers to co-maintaine= r some > > of their ebuilds. They just stay quiet on their corner and do nothing. = Since > > Council is supposed to be the leading entity of Gentoo I was wondering = how > > come this issue never popped up on any of your meetings. Do you really = don't > > see a problem here or I am just that weird and everything is running sm= oothly? >=20 > This has been raised on previous council meetings, as far as I can > remember not recently, though. > I agree Gentoo has a problem with dead teams, but I don't think this > problem can be fixed "by decree". Either we can get new people > interested in a team=20 Really? I am pretty sure that there are quite a lot of people out there that want to help but they simply can't get in touch with slow ( lets don't say "dear" ) projects. Just look at the bugs of these projects. There are tons = of patches attached but projects don't give a shit. > or if possible we may have to drop it, but I > believe a team status won't change just because council labels it as > "moribund" or "dead". This is not about labeling. This is about reality. If a project is really dead, remove it from the list, assign the bugs to maintainer-needed and let everybody know that there is really nobody looking after these packages.=20 I think users prefer a smaller ( ebuild number wise ) but more active proje= ct than a big and slow one. --=20 Markos Chandras (hwoarang) Gentoo Linux Developer Web: http://hwoarang.silverarrow.org Key ID: 441AC410 Key FP: AAD0 8591 E3CD 445D 6411 3477 F7F7 1E8E 441A C410 --HG+GLK89HZ1zG0kk Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.16 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAkxelJIACgkQ9/cejkQaxBAhuACePIlpLiddcda4hr5kJ3HXOSRl uvIAmQGbRap9G8OgLATxE3OxPpG4A47G =cJXP -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --HG+GLK89HZ1zG0kk--