From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org ([208.92.234.80] helo=lists.gentoo.org) by finch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1OPfqG-0002z4-Sb for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Fri, 18 Jun 2010 17:59:01 +0000 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 704B4E0913; Fri, 18 Jun 2010 17:58:53 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-pz0-f53.google.com (mail-pz0-f53.google.com [209.85.210.53]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EDF00E08E1 for ; Fri, 18 Jun 2010 17:58:19 +0000 (UTC) Received: by pzk12 with SMTP id 12so28644pzk.40 for ; Fri, 18 Jun 2010 10:58:19 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:received:date:from:to:subject :message-id:references:mime-version:content-type:content-disposition :in-reply-to:user-agent; bh=dIY1NUgOKmvlwltHiTyqatOOJmBXRFSQOMvqMj8hKuw=; b=X0vWYVBbhucsHRGOjtoxtPakh8t5OtsouBY3YR0XxN52ae9Kh6/WKWg/+XyLSNzg+p tW3iAouAL9EUH2TG4RQMTJGfRmJAs3pD5E6/pLrKst0KTgK0j7DuunVL5ANJUe5ux0ro tWzk75zkglGDohr5St8D0eM00e5xY+ys/jQHg= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=date:from:to:subject:message-id:references:mime-version :content-type:content-disposition:in-reply-to:user-agent; b=Cghl/o8UAaup8jHyanO7S6/u12p3ejQfz1yojwM/BrtG1WvR1kj2yTwQJ2VgSBOyKQ VYIdBdwxJ+1JxF5znfQtPXzvSMHnqGxbPb/rGUTGjbWOFlVUTgurR6fW4eomIpoc9b6x 4FnXc6IiUgoelscvTiwKGnZ4fed9htTQhDAdg= Received: by 10.141.53.12 with SMTP id f12mr1154320rvk.142.1276883899449; Fri, 18 Jun 2010 10:58:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp.gmail.com (c-67-171-128-62.hsd1.wa.comcast.net [67.171.128.62]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id r23sm9500433rvq.0.2010.06.18.10.58.16 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Fri, 18 Jun 2010 10:58:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: by smtp.gmail.com (sSMTP sendmail emulation); Fri, 18 Jun 2010 10:56:19 -0700 Date: Fri, 18 Jun 2010 10:56:19 -0700 From: Brian Harring To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Adding AdobeFlash-10{,.1} licenses to EULA group Message-ID: <20100618175619.GF12490@hrair> References: <4C169D32.5080706@gentoo.org> <4C1A9E38.8050206@gmail.com> <20100618014229.GA12490@hrair> <201006181108.29193.polynomial-c@gentoo.org> <4C1B7B7E.70701@gentoo.org> Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="Lb0e7rgc7IsuDeGj" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <4C1B7B7E.70701@gentoo.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.20 (2009-06-14) X-Archives-Salt: 261acdc0-b8b6-4d60-b8fe-43aaaa1b7ec5 X-Archives-Hash: 0971b5de473d7c86992d46519f43eff7 --Lb0e7rgc7IsuDeGj Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Fri, Jun 18, 2010 at 03:58:22PM +0200, Angelo Arrifano wrote: > Why? You are running a free and opensource operating system, what's > wrong suggesting *other* free and opensource alternatives? You are just > providing the user a choice, not to actually oblige him to install anythi= ng. Some of us have 'no solicitation' signs on our doors for a reason. If=20 you're not familiar w/ the concept, it's essentially a legal warning=20 to keep various idealogical people from coming up to our doors and=20 trying to tell us how their particular religion will save our souls. You've got some invalid assumptions here. While gentoo infra is ran=20 on strictly OSS, the tree has always been pragmatic- because it's the=20 consumers *choice* if they want to run an idealogically pure system. =20 What you're proposing is converting the tree away from it's neutral=20 stance that "the consumer is an adult and can make their own=20 decisions" to "the consumer should be told they should use a better=20 pkg regardless of if it's equivalent in features". This sort of thing is where I honestly wish there was a FSF=20 no-solicitation sign I could purchase. We have license filtering already, meaning the pkg in question isn't=20 even visible on a default portage install. This is equivalent to=20 having a safety on the gun that is pkg merging. Your request is at=20 best requesting a second safety be added, at worst trying to push=20 idealogical decisions into what is purely a technical matter. > >> Maybe I expressed myself a bit misinterpretative. I don't want to requ= est an > >> elog message telling users about alternative packages. But in my opini= on an > >> elog message pointing at the bald-faced parts of Adobe's license shoul= d be > >> added. These parts about allowing Adobe to install further content pro= tection > >> software is just too dangerous in my opinion. > >=20 > > I will ignore the technical portion where basically any binary on your > > system; even binaries you compiled yourself have the ability to > > 'install things you do not like' when run as root (and sometimes when > > run as a normal user as well.) >=20 > For all the years running Linux, I never found that case. That's reality. If in doubt, read some glsa/cve's, or go read into=20 the recent brewha about unrealircd. Or go look into exactly what cpan, setuptools/dispatch, or gems do. =20 Hell, look into the automated pkg updating in most integrated binary=20 distro's. Can't count the number of times they've installed shit I=20 didn't want (specifically not wanting it because it broke my system=20 yet again). Simply put, you run whatever the hell you want on your system,=20 literally, your choice. I will not deprive you of that choice, nor will I stick in little=20 nagging messages to pkgs you use suggesting you use something I think=20 is idealogically better (whether it be DRM related, proprietary=20 license, or just plain binary blobs). Please show me the same respect I show you. Deal? It really is that simple from where I'm sitting. The user is an=20 adult, they're free to make whatever decision they want (even if you=20 vehemently think said decision is wrong). ~harring --Lb0e7rgc7IsuDeGj Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.15 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAkwbs0MACgkQsiLx3HvNzgfy6QCfVnMzzuLZVYMPzghTyBhYtGvs LP0AniNXi8An7QXCjpGa44TfP1fXeAyA =Qz1d -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Lb0e7rgc7IsuDeGj--