From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org ([208.92.234.80] helo=lists.gentoo.org) by finch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1NUlNs-0004Aa-UL for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Tue, 12 Jan 2010 18:22:33 +0000 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 41EC1E0817; Tue, 12 Jan 2010 18:22:01 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp-vbr19.xs4all.nl (smtp-vbr19.xs4all.nl [194.109.24.39]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D9A6CE0817 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 2010 18:22:00 +0000 (UTC) Received: from epia.jer-c2.orkz.net (atwork-106.r-212.178.112.atwork.nl [212.178.112.106]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-vbr19.xs4all.nl (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id o0CILxSP082022 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 2010 19:22:00 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from jer@gentoo.org) Date: Tue, 12 Jan 2010 19:21:59 +0100 From: Jeroen Roovers To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Last rites: net-nntp/inn Message-ID: <20100112192159.0fa03cd1@epia.jer-c2.orkz.net> In-Reply-To: <201001121832.11523.hwoarang@gentoo.org> References: <201001112305.16532.hwoarang@gentoo.org> <20100112020214.7a5e1234@epia.jer-c2.orkz.net> <20100112032205.51f939f2@epia.jer-c2.orkz.net> <201001121832.11523.hwoarang@gentoo.org> X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.7.3 (GTK+ 2.16.6; i686-pc-linux-gnu) Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by XS4ALL Virus Scanner X-Archives-Salt: 878ab0ec-5414-41dc-8d05-b100b79b2d96 X-Archives-Hash: 74f5316a80f6521b21c0ca0be1a9704c On Tue, 12 Jan 2010 18:32:06 +0200 Markos Chandras wrote: > Thanks for saving this package. As Jeremy said, there is absolutely > no way to measure the popularity of a package. So if it has no > maintainer, and open bugs we have to mask it and announce it here. It > is up to you whether you want to save it or not I don't think the (perceived) popularity of the package has anything to do with it. I do think maybe treecleaner@ needs to set up policies with regard to methods of investigation, thoroughness, and transparency. In the case at hand, treecleaner shouldn't have been called in (you're not the bloody cavalry you know! ;-) in the first place, and should certainly not have acted (so quickly). It's not clear to me generally what you (treecleaner@) all do and why you do it - but it *is* clear that it's very easy to `rm -r *' to get rid of some old stuff and that you may end up regretting it later. Particularly, it looks like the net-mail, net-news and netmon herds are understaffed and have been for a while, and I see a general shift of developers towards desktop oriented packages and away from the nuts and bolts that make it all go. I think (but have no facts apart from talking to people and handling network package related bugs in every way possible) that our userbase is still much more technically oriented. If that's all true, then doing some `rm net-*/*' cleanups may well end up hurting Gentoo as you would drive out more of the networking oriented people (users and developers) that I feel we still need to support, and turn into Yet Another Desktop Oriented Distro (which we also need, but that's already covered quite well). ISTR treecleaner@ already had some policy in place that requires some $period to pass before you mask for removal. Maybe you should announce an upcoming mask nice and early to keep that shock wave from reaching users straight away. Regards, jer