[gentoo-dev] Changes to some profiles

[gentoo-dev] Changes to some profiles

[Chris Gianelloni]

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OK, so I built a complete set of stages (with no circular dependencies!)
on amd64 for testing, using both the "default-linux/amd64/dev/2008.0"
and the "default-linux/amd64/dev/2008.0/desktop" profiles with the
following changes and everything worked perfectly.  I would like to
replicate this to the tree before the snapshot today.  If nobody has any
objections in the next 12 hours or so, I'm going to do it.

base/packages:
removed debianutils
removed perl
removed python
changed sys-apps/portage to virtual/portage

default-linux/packages.build:
removed perl
removed python
changed sys-apps/baselayout to virtual/baselayout
changed sys-apps/portage to virtual/portage

Even without perl/python in packages.build, we still end up with both in
stage1's tarball.  We pull in perl via auto{conf,make} and python via
portage (duh).  I'd like to also try removing autoconf and automake from
packages and packages.build above, since things *should* now be
depending on them if they need them.  Of course, I won't commit that
until after posting here again after testing it and being sure it's
good.

-- 
Chris Gianelloni
Release Engineering Strategic Lead
Games Developer

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Changes to some profiles

[Petteri Räty]

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Chris Gianelloni kirjoitti:
> 
> base/packages:
> removed debianutils

I don't think we reached a decision on whether debianutils should go to 
kernel-2.eclass before this is done.

Regards,
Petteri


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Re: [gentoo-dev] Changes to some profiles

[Mike Frysinger]

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On Friday 01 February 2008, Petteri Räty wrote:
> Chris Gianelloni kirjoitti:
> > base/packages:
> > removed debianutils
>
> I don't think we reached a decision on whether debianutils should go to
> kernel-2.eclass before this is done.

i think the answer is no
-mike

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[gentoo-dev] Re: Changes to some profiles

[Duncan]

Mike Frysinger <vapier@gentoo.org> posted
200802011705.18653.vapier@gentoo.org, excerpted below, on  Fri, 01 Feb
2008 17:05:18 -0500:

> On Friday 01 February 2008, Petteri Räty wrote:
>> Chris Gianelloni kirjoitti:
>> > base/packages:
>> > removed debianutils
>>
>> I don't think we reached a decision on whether debianutils should go to
>> kernel-2.eclass before this is done.
> 
> i think the answer is no

Not that I have a vote, but as I raised that possible objection earlier, 
agreed.  Folks who have it already merged will be fine unless they 
--depclean without first checking what it'll do, and those that don't 
have it merged can merge it if they need it -- it's not as if it's 
leaving the tree, and the kernel doesn't hard-depend on it.

A GWN or similar announcement before it moves beyond the dev profiles 
would be nice, but if the affected devs (incl. bugwranglers) are willing 
to deal with the complaints and they seem to be, the leaner system and 
image is IMO a good thing, and announcement or not, people really 
/should/ be checking their depcleans. =8^)

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Changes to some profiles

[Vlastimil Babka]

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Duncan wrote:
> A GWN or similar announcement before it moves beyond the dev profiles 
> would be nice, but if the affected devs (incl. bugwranglers) are willing 
> to deal with the complaints and they seem to be, the leaner system and 
> image is IMO a good thing, and announcement or not, people really 
> /should/ be checking their depcleans. =8^)

How about just some elog "If you use make install, emerge --noreplace 
debianutils" in the kernel's postinst or something.

Though I wonder why kernel depends on stuff like $distroutils :)

VB


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Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Changes to some profiles

[Rémi Cardona]

Vlastimil Babka a écrit :
> How about just some elog "If you use make install, emerge --noreplace 
> debianutils" in the kernel's postinst or something.

Bellow is my contribution to this thread :)

Cheers,

Rémi


--- kernel-2.eclass	2007-12-17 17:06:02.000000000 +0100
+++ kernel-2.eclass	2008-02-02 09:48:25.000000000 +0100
@@ -659,6 +659,11 @@ postinst_sources() {
  		ewarn "For specific information on why this kernel is unsupported, 
please read:"
  		ewarn "http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/security/kernel.xml"
  	fi
+
+	# display debianutils message
+	echo
+	einfo "If you use \"make install\" to install your kernel to /boot,"
+	einfo "you will need to emerge \"sys-apps/debianutils\""
  }

  postinst_headers() {

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Changes to some profiles

[Marius Mauch]

On Sat, 02 Feb 2008 09:50:21 +0100
Rémi Cardona <remi@gentoo.org> wrote:

> Vlastimil Babka a écrit :
> > How about just some elog "If you use make install, emerge
> > --noreplace debianutils" in the kernel's postinst or something.
> 
> Bellow is my contribution to this thread :)
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Rémi
> 
> 
> --- kernel-2.eclass	2007-12-17 17:06:02.000000000 +0100
> +++ kernel-2.eclass	2008-02-02 09:48:25.000000000 +0100
> @@ -659,6 +659,11 @@ postinst_sources() {
>   		ewarn "For specific information on why this kernel
> is unsupported, please read:"
>   		ewarn
> "http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/security/kernel.xml" fi
> +
> +	# display debianutils message
> +	echo
> +	einfo "If you use \"make install\" to install your kernel
> to /boot,"
> +	einfo "you will need to emerge \"sys-apps/debianutils\""
>   }
> 
>   postinst_headers() {

s/einfo/elog/ and people might even read it ;)

Marius
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[gentoo-dev] Re: Changes to some profiles

[Duncan]

Vlastimil Babka <caster@gentoo.org> posted 47A3CD80.8060008@gentoo.org,
excerpted below, on  Sat, 02 Feb 2008 02:55:12 +0100:

> How about just some elog "If you use make install, emerge --noreplace
> debianutils" in the kernel's postinst or something.

Well, that doesn't help those who get their kernels elsewhere, which IMO 
are the ones most likely to have their own scripted solutions using make 
install and thus debianutils in the first place, thus the general 
announcement suggestion, but a kernel-2.eclass einfo as proposed is a 
start and certainly won't hurt. =8^)  (Also, as I've said, folks with 
such site-customized scripts are precisely the ones advanced enough they 
/should/ catch it and be well able to make the necessary changes 
themselves, regardless of warning, but should != will, and a GMN/GWN/
upgrade-guide warning is a nice touch in any case.)

-- 
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and if you use the program, he is your master."  Richard Stallman

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Changes to some profiles

[Chris Gianelloni]

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On Sat, 2008-02-02 at 09:45 +0000, Duncan wrote:
> > How about just some elog "If you use make install, emerge --noreplace
> > debianutils" in the kernel's postinst or something.
> 
> Well, that doesn't help those who get their kernels elsewhere, which IMO 
> are the ones most likely to have their own scripted solutions using make 
> install and thus debianutils in the first place, thus the general 
> announcement suggestion, but a kernel-2.eclass einfo as proposed is a 
> start and certainly won't hurt. =8^)  (Also, as I've said, folks with 
> such site-customized scripts are precisely the ones advanced enough they 
> /should/ catch it and be well able to make the necessary changes 
> themselves, regardless of warning, but should != will, and a GMN/GWN/
> upgrade-guide warning is a nice touch in any case.)

Well, we can hold off adding it to the actual tree until after the next
GMN, so that's not really an issue.

My main question was if there was any opposition, and it appears that
there is none, so long as information is provided to our users.  I'm in
total agreement.

If I don't hear any complaints, I'd like to go ahead and get a GMN
article together.

Do we really need a front-page news item for this?  I don't think the
impact would be terribly great, as I suspect this affects a very small
number of people whom are likely to be more advanced users.  I think
adding the info to GMN/gentoo-dev-announce/gentoo-user should suffice.
If someone thinks we need to do a front-page article, we can do that,
too.

-- 
Chris Gianelloni
Release Engineering Strategic Lead
Games Developer

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[gentoo-dev] Re: Changes to some profiles

[Christian Faulhammer]

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Hi,

Chris Gianelloni <wolf31o2@gentoo.org>:

> If I don't hear any complaints, I'd like to go ahead and get a GMN
> article together.

 Good to go in my eyes...
 
> Do we really need a front-page news item for this?  I don't think the
> impact would be terribly great, as I suspect this affects a very small
> number of people whom are likely to be more advanced users.  I think
> adding the info to GMN/gentoo-dev-announce/gentoo-user should suffice.
> If someone thinks we need to do a front-page article, we can do that,
> too.

 And I agree here, too.

V-Li

P.S.: Wow, I made an AOL.

-- 
Christian Faulhammer, Gentoo Lisp project
<URL:http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/lisp/>, #gentoo-lisp on FreeNode

<URL:http://www.faulhammer.org/>

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Changes to some profiles

[Vlastimil Babka]

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Chris Gianelloni wrote:
> Do we really need a front-page news item for this?  I don't think the
> impact would be terribly great, as I suspect this affects a very small
> number of people whom are likely to be more advanced users.  I think
> adding the info to GMN/gentoo-dev-announce/gentoo-user should suffice.
> If someone thinks we need to do a front-page article, we can do that,
> too.

IIRC it will affect only 2008 profiles, and not older, so people have to 
switch profiles first? Which already involves knowing what you're doing?
So what about putting up a GMN/front page article announcing all such 
changes in new profiles, and not just for debianutils removal. I don't 
recall there was this kind of article/documentation before, but might be 
wrong.

Vlastimil


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Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Changes to some profiles

[Chris Gianelloni]

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On Sat, 2008-02-02 at 14:21 +0100, Vlastimil Babka wrote:
> Chris Gianelloni wrote:
> > Do we really need a front-page news item for this?  I don't think the
> > impact would be terribly great, as I suspect this affects a very small
> > number of people whom are likely to be more advanced users.  I think
> > adding the info to GMN/gentoo-dev-announce/gentoo-user should suffice.
> > If someone thinks we need to do a front-page article, we can do that,
> > too.
> 
> IIRC it will affect only 2008 profiles, and not older, so people have to 
> switch profiles first? Which already involves knowing what you're doing?
> So what about putting up a GMN/front page article announcing all such 
> changes in new profiles, and not just for debianutils removal. I don't 
> recall there was this kind of article/documentation before, but might be 
> wrong.

Ehh, I didn't say I was only doing it for 2008.0's profiles.  I *could*
but there's not really much point.  The package isn't needed in "system"
for anything to compile/run, so why should we force it onto everyone's
machines?

-- 
Chris Gianelloni
Release Engineering Strategic Lead
Games Developer

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[gentoo-dev] Re: Changes to some profiles

[Duncan]

Chris Gianelloni <wolf31o2@gentoo.org> posted
1201956353.14162.44.camel@inertia.twi-31o2.org, excerpted below, on  Sat,
02 Feb 2008 04:45:53 -0800:

> Well, we can hold off adding it to the actual tree until after the next
> GMN, so that's not really an issue.
> 
> My main question was if there was any opposition, and it appears that
> there is none, so long as information is provided to our users. []
> If I don't hear any complaints, I'd like to go ahead and get a GMN
> article together.
> 
> Do we really need a front-page news item for this?  []  I think
> adding the info to GMN/gentoo-dev-announce/gentoo-user should suffice.

++ from here, to everything.  Thanks for your care. =8^)

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and if you use the program, he is your master."  Richard Stallman

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Changes to some profiles

[Chris Gianelloni]

On Fri, 2008-02-01 at 23:47 +0200, Petteri Räty wrote:
> Chris Gianelloni kirjoitti:
> > 
> > base/packages:
> > removed debianutils
> 
> I don't think we reached a decision on whether debianutils should go to 
> kernel-2.eclass before this is done.

Actually, it isn't very important if it happens or not (to me/release),
and doesn't change that I'll be testing with it, either way.  After all,
it's a rather simple change to revert.  That being said, you've got
until March 10th (final snapshot freeze) to decide.  ;]

-- 
Chris Gianelloni
Release Engineering Strategic Lead
Games Developer
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