Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Improving developer/user communication (was Re: net-im/pidgin protocols)

[Ciaran McCreesh <ciaranm@ciaranm.org>]

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On Thu, 19 Jul 2007 22:22:19 +0100
George Prowse <cokehabit@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Not my point. My point is that most Gentoo users would either not
> > see the question or not respond. Those that both see the question
> > and take time to respond are highly atypical.
> 
> If you were clever enough and wanted the largest amount of answers
> you would put the questions around ever communication channel gentoo
> has, you would then get the opinions of the majority of users.

No, you'd still be way off. You'd still only get the opinions of users
who actively monitor Gentoo communication channels. It's well
established from the fallout of previous changes that no matter how
widely something is communicated, most people won't see it until their
system breaks and they try to find out why.

> >> I wish ALL users would vote in a poll on the forums
> > 
> > That wouldn't tell you what all users want though. It would tell you
> > what forum users who take the time to respond to a poll want. Again,
> > not a representative sample. And that's the issue at hand -- Gentoo
> > has an extremely hard time delivering information to most users.
> > Getting information back is even trickier. The set of people who
> > respond is heavily skewed towards better-informed users who have
> > time to seek out and participate in that kind of questioning.
> 
> Ahhhhh, now I see! The fact that we would get answers from some users
> is the reason why it shouldn't be done

No no. The fact that some people would use those answers to make design
decisions is why it shouldn't be done.

> >> as to what we the users want and what direction we want Gentoo to
> >> go in.
> > 
> > I want guaranteed total stability, instantly available updates,
> > guaranteed backwards compatibility, the ability to install any
> > package from source using my configuration of choice in under
> > fifteen seconds and a herd of nubile bisexual redheads. Can Gentoo
> > deliver that?
> 
> Irrelevant conclusion

Not at all. What users *want* is something that can't be done. Most
users don't have the technical knowledge to realise that what they want
is impossible. Asking users will thus merely get a long list of
impossible goals.

> >> It's no different than elections here in the US, people gripe but
> >> most of the gripers don't vote.
> > 
> > Do you really think it would make any difference if they did? All it
> > would do is lend credibility to the process, and provide people with
> > the argument "well you voted so you agree to accept the decision of
> > the majority".
>
> It would make a difference in the relations between users and
> developers.

Yes, lots of users would be extremely annoyed when they're told "sorry,
we're not going to deliver all those things you asked for".

> Being a user yourself, why are you so against yourself having a say?

I have a say, as does anyone else who feels like contributing. Were
things moved to a poll, no-one would have a say at all.

-- 
Ciaran McCreesh


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