From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from lists.gentoo.org ([140.105.134.102] helo=robin.gentoo.org) by nuthatch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.54) id 1ExQ28-0000hY-8W for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Fri, 13 Jan 2006 14:36:04 +0000 Received: from robin.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by robin.gentoo.org (8.13.5/8.13.5) with SMTP id k0DEZK32015181; Fri, 13 Jan 2006 14:35:20 GMT Received: from callisto.cs.kun.nl (callisto.cs.kun.nl [131.174.33.75]) by robin.gentoo.org (8.13.5/8.13.5) with ESMTP id k0DEWGNd030797 for ; Fri, 13 Jan 2006 14:32:16 GMT Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by callisto.cs.kun.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7C9542E8275 for ; Fri, 13 Jan 2006 15:32:41 +0100 (CET) From: Paul de Vrieze To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Monthly Gentoo Council Reminder for January Date: Fri, 13 Jan 2006 15:32:40 +0100 User-Agent: KMail/1.9 References: <1136226795.8779.10.camel@localhost> <20060105043130.GI1967@mail.lieber.org> <20060105200939.GA25297@vino.zko.hp.com> In-Reply-To: <20060105200939.GA25297@vino.zko.hp.com> X-Face: #Lb+'V@sGJ;ptgo5}V"W+5OCoo{LZv;bh,s,`WKLi/J)ed1_$0;6X<=?utf-8?q?700LVV/=3BLqPhiDP=5E=0A=09=27f=5Dfnv?=@%6M8\'HR1t=aFx;ePfp{ZQoBe+e)JOQ8T5*(_;mHY+cltLGq<;@$Y,=?utf-8?q?O=5C=24=0A=09Tm=23G6M?=,g![Q62J{na*S9d;R[^8pc%u\aiLqU@`kJtYl"^6pxdW Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="nextPart1502085.pgHCxu7N9I"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <200601131532.41159.pauldv@gentoo.org> X-Archives-Salt: 11a4f7a6-aa65-4885-90fb-bb120e1b080a X-Archives-Hash: ff99d50f84e531186413bf9a5af9f17c --nextPart1502085.pgHCxu7N9I Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline On Thursday 05 January 2006 21:09, Aron Griffis wrote: > I think there is a Post Hoc fallacy happening here: A happened before > B, therefore A must be causing B. In the case at hand: A =3D loss of > leader, B =3D lack of progress. While A might be the cause of B, it is > dangerous to jump to that conclusion without more than the sequence as > support. =46rom what I remember from talking with Daniel, the oposite is more=20 through. Daniel felt that things were getting nowhere, he was overloaded=20 and brickwalled at the same time, and to make worse had financial=20 problems. So indeed rather a fallacy. > First, Gentoo's developers are not going to follow a leader's > direction unless they sincerely agree with it. Since we're all > volunteers, the only cooperative work we're going to see is when > people agree with a goal. Therefore it doesn't matter whether you > name somebody "our leader" or if they're just another developer, > either way they're going to have to convince people to play along. > Our current model already allows for centralized leadership via > meritocracy: any developer can step up to the plate and be king for > the day, they just have to have a good idea and convince others to go > along with it. People should also notice the difference between leader and boss. > Second, I think the factualness of B is in question. A few people > have brought up examples of progress being made within Gentoo. The > problem here appears to be that the progress being made is not in the > same areas where some people are looking. Which brings up the > question: How is Gentoo falling short in your eyes? Are you certain > that those specific areas are related to the non-existence of a boss? Part of it is portage, and that is getting somewhere now. The "boss"=20 stepped down, so that others than him can work on it too. Paul =2D-=20 Paul de Vrieze Gentoo Developer Mail: pauldv@gentoo.org Homepage: http://www.devrieze.net --nextPart1502085.pgHCxu7N9I Content-Type: application/pgp-signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2-ecc0.1.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQBDx7oJbKx5DBjWFdsRAtWiAJ4hkz7gQBzWdhNX1dOGuyZncVzeFwCg5Y44 HTJ5Mo1dhabE1u2GWCdnkGg= =SQKB -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --nextPart1502085.pgHCxu7N9I-- -- gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list