From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from lists.gentoo.org ([140.105.134.102] helo=robin.gentoo.org) by nuthatch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.54) id 1EubV9-00009A-GD for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Thu, 05 Jan 2006 20:14:23 +0000 Received: from robin.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by robin.gentoo.org (8.13.5/8.13.5) with SMTP id k05KDXcZ018181; Thu, 5 Jan 2006 20:13:33 GMT Received: from smtp.gentoo.org (smtp.gentoo.org [134.68.220.30]) by robin.gentoo.org (8.13.5/8.13.5) with ESMTP id k05KBJ7p007113 for ; Thu, 5 Jan 2006 20:11:19 GMT Received: from agriffis by smtp.gentoo.org with local (Exim 4.54) id 1EubSA-0003Wn-RJ for gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org; Thu, 05 Jan 2006 20:11:18 +0000 Date: Thu, 5 Jan 2006 15:09:39 -0500 X-OfflineIMAP-2115466710-64676f73656e64-494e424f582e4f7574626f78: 1136491878-0807111306869-v4.0.11 From: Aron Griffis To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Monthly Gentoo Council Reminder for January Message-ID: <20060105200939.GA25297@vino.zko.hp.com> Mail-Followup-To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org References: <1136226795.8779.10.camel@localhost> <43B975FD.1000401@gentoo.org> <1136228634.23404.125.camel@localhost> <1136230095.8779.32.camel@localhost> <43BAB220.1030601@gentoo.org> <43BAB438.8000301@gentoo.org> <1136312226.27358.59.camel@cgianelloni.nuvox.net> <20060105035857.GH1967@mail.lieber.org> <20060105035706.GA23895@kroah.com> <20060105043130.GI1967@mail.lieber.org> Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="k+w/mQv8wyuph6w0" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20060105043130.GI1967@mail.lieber.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.11 X-Archives-Salt: 60a64c55-4946-4f3d-aefa-ed906b054b4b X-Archives-Hash: 7aab4e60482fbf1565a2ccea0c007811 --k+w/mQv8wyuph6w0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Kurt, Kurt Lieber wrote: [Wed Jan 04 2006, 11:31:30PM EST] > > Ok, then what should Gentoo do to fix this percieved decline? >=20 > Exactly what a lot of folks will have kittens about; appoint a CEO, > leader, boss, manager, etc. (you know, all those corporate-type > words that raise the hackles of nearly everyone on this list.) I think there is a Post Hoc fallacy happening here: A happened before B, therefore A must be causing B. In the case at hand: A =3D loss of leader, B =3D lack of progress. While A might be the cause of B, it is dangerous to jump to that conclusion without more than the sequence as support. I don't think I can solidly refute the possibility of a relationship, but here is some food for thought: First, Gentoo's developers are not going to follow a leader's direction unless they sincerely agree with it. Since we're all volunteers, the only cooperative work we're going to see is when people agree with a goal. Therefore it doesn't matter whether you name somebody "our leader" or if they're just another developer, either way they're going to have to convince people to play along. Our current model already allows for centralized leadership via meritocracy: any developer can step up to the plate and be king for the day, they just have to have a good idea and convince others to go along with it. =20 Second, I think the factualness of B is in question. A few people have brought up examples of progress being made within Gentoo. The problem here appears to be that the progress being made is not in the same areas where some people are looking. Which brings up the question: How is Gentoo falling short in your eyes? Are you certain that those specific areas are related to the non-existence of a boss? Regards, Aron -- Aron Griffis Gentoo Linux Developer --k+w/mQv8wyuph6w0 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFDvX0DJrHF4yAQTrARAnDpAJ9cyr+XpXVqeps+LJzXQ2b/OGMDhACgp/3a MZw3npEzX6oUKbR5lT7mM+s= =RoFi -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --k+w/mQv8wyuph6w0-- -- gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list