[gentoo-dev] last rites for net-im/sim

[gentoo-dev] last rites for net-im/sim

[Carsten Lohrke]

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When you are interested in sim and willing to fix all bugs¹ and takeover 
maintainership) speak now. Christmas morning I'll crucify it.


Carsten


[1] https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=110241

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Re: [gentoo-dev] last rites for net-im/sim

[Bruno]

On Saturday 17 December 2005 20:54, Carsten Lohrke wrote:
> When you are interested in sim and willing to fix all bugs¹ and takeover
> maintainership) speak now. Christmas morning I'll crucify it.
>
>
> Carsten
>
>
> [1] https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=110241

For moving over to the forked sim on berlios 
(http://sim-im.berlios.de/wiki/Main_Page), is it better to keep sim masked in 
portage and then continue with the forked releases once they come up, or just 
restart from zero?

>From user point of view I guess the continuity option may be better...

Bruno

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Re: [gentoo-dev] last rites for net-im/sim

[George Shapovalov]

Ugh, it is the only one that reliably connects to icq (yea, I am stuck using 
it for many people whom I contact as this is pretty much the only protocol 
"honored" there) *and* handles various encodings in a sane way (no, gaim, 
while been really nice on a protocol side, does not cut it on localization 
side, not even close. And kopete is the other way around :))..

So, I too would say, please at least keep it in the tree..
There is a plea in that bug, btw, to give somebody a month to fix it, so there 
is still hope :)..

George

On Sunday, 18. December 2005 09:14, Bruno wrote:
> On Saturday 17 December 2005 20:54, Carsten Lohrke wrote:
> > When you are interested in sim and willing to fix all bugs¹ and takeover
> > maintainership) speak now. Christmas morning I'll crucify it.
> For moving over to the forked sim on berlios
> (http://sim-im.berlios.de/wiki/Main_Page), is it better to keep sim masked
> in portage and then continue with the forked releases once they come up, or
> just restart from zero?
>
> From user point of view I guess the continuity option may be better...
>
> Bruno

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Re: [gentoo-dev] last rites for net-im/sim

[Olivier Crete]

On Mon, 2005-19-12 at 12:19 +0100, George Shapovalov wrote:
> Ugh, it is the only one that reliably connects to icq (yea, I am stuck using 
> it for many people whom I contact as this is pretty much the only protocol 
> "honored" there) *and* handles various encodings in a sane way (no, gaim, 
> while been really nice on a protocol side, does not cut it on localization 
> side, not even close. And kopete is the other way around :))..

You may want to try GnomeICU for ICQ.

-- 
Olivier Crête
tester@gentoo.org
Gentoo Developer


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Re: [gentoo-dev] last rites for net-im/sim

[George Shapovalov]

Thanks, I'll try, but seeing gnome in the name I am quite skeptical. It's 
really nothing personal. Its just in my experience gnome/gtk apps could never 
handle cyrillic well enough in all situations..

Yea, cyrillic is a bitch. Its probably worse than chineese, no really :). 
These guys were later to the game, so even though they have like tons of 
variants and intrinsically more complex stuff, at least they got it right. 
With cyrillic we have like 4 different encodings for the very same thing, and 
3 of them are widely used (ironically, the one not used much is the "official 
standard", well, as usual :)). So, you can imagine people having set their 
environment to one encoding, client reporting another and, to top it off, 
messages getting recoded while on the server (at least I can see a difference 
when some poeple shift to direct mode after having logged in, versus messaged 
left on server when somebody is out.. Well, that might be a server screwing 
some reported settings, but that does not help.). As you can guess, I can't 
wait for the last non-utf-8 aware app to die painfull death :) (whell, where 
this kind of stuff is important of course).

Interestingly kde-based stuff somehow works most of the time, and when it does 
not, you can force the right encoding for that particular user (at least for 
both kopete and sim, not so with gaim).
Ok, I better stop bitching and go fix some more bugs :), but thanks for the 
suggestion anyway..

George

On Monday, 19. December 2005 18:53, Olivier Crete wrote:
> On Mon, 2005-19-12 at 12:19 +0100, George Shapovalov wrote:
> > Ugh, it is the only one that reliably connects to icq (yea, I am stuck
> > using it for many people whom I contact as this is pretty much the only
> > protocol "honored" there) *and* handles various encodings in a sane way
> > (no, gaim, while been really nice on a protocol side, does not cut it on
> > localization side, not even close. And kopete is the other way around
> > :))..
>
> You may want to try GnomeICU for ICQ.
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Re: [gentoo-dev] last rites for net-im/sim

[Olivier Crete]

On Mon, 2005-19-12 at 21:08 +0100, George Shapovalov wrote:
> Thanks, I'll try, but seeing gnome in the name I am quite skeptical. It's 
> really nothing personal. Its just in my experience gnome/gtk apps could never 
> handle cyrillic well enough in all situations..
> 
> Yea, cyrillic is a bitch. Its probably worse than chineese, no really :). 
> These guys were later to the game, so even though they have like tons of 
> variants and intrinsically more complex stuff, at least they got it right. 
> With cyrillic we have like 4 different encodings for the very same thing, and 
> 3 of them are widely used (ironically, the one not used much is the "official 
> standard", well, as usual :)). So, you can imagine people having set their 
> environment to one encoding, client reporting another and, to top it off, 
> messages getting recoded while on the server (at least I can see a difference 
> when some poeple shift to direct mode after having logged in, versus messaged 
> left on server when somebody is out.. Well, that might be a server screwing 
> some reported settings, but that does not help.). As you can guess, I can't 
> wait for the last non-utf-8 aware app to die painfull death :) (whell, where 
> this kind of stuff is important of course).

Modern ICQ is either unicode or specifies the encoding (but as a windows
locale and not a regular encoding..). Old ICQ sucks and you have to
guess.. If you have problems with GnomeICU.. please file a bug at
bugzilla.gnome.org .. I'm the upstream maintainer too...

-- 
Olivier Crête
tester@gentoo.org
Gentoo Developer


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Re: [gentoo-dev] last rites for net-im/sim

[Stephen P. Becker]

George Shapovalov wrote:
> Ugh, it is the only one that reliably connects to icq (yea, I am stuck using 
> it for many people whom I contact as this is pretty much the only protocol 
> "honored" there) *and* handles various encodings in a sane way (no, gaim, 
> while been really nice on a protocol side, does not cut it on localization 
> side, not even close. And kopete is the other way around :))..

I can't really say anything about gaim's localization, but what is wrong 
with kopete on the protocol side of things?  I haven't had a single 
problem with icq and kopete.  MSN is a different story, however....

-Steve
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Re: [gentoo-dev] last rites for net-im/sim

[George Shapovalov]

Well, I cannot say anything about msn, as I have nobody using it. As for icq, 
good for you then :). I am hitting that famous login bug - just cannot login 
whether I use either of the standard login sites (are there any more?)..
I should admit though, things have "improved" somewhat. Now, with kde-3.5 
kopete does not spit out that message about unknown error, instead it keeps 
trying.. and trying, and trying... 
So, there is some hope that it may start working for me in, say 3.5.3, or at 
least 4.1 :).

George

On Monday, 19. December 2005 19:05, Stephen P. Becker wrote:
> George Shapovalov wrote:
> > Ugh, it is the only one that reliably connects to icq (yea, I am stuck
> > using it for many people whom I contact as this is pretty much the only
> > protocol "honored" there) *and* handles various encodings in a sane way
> > (no, gaim, while been really nice on a protocol side, does not cut it on
> > localization side, not even close. And kopete is the other way around
> > :))..
>
> I can't really say anything about gaim's localization, but what is wrong
> with kopete on the protocol side of things?  I haven't had a single
> problem with icq and kopete.  MSN is a different story, however....
>
> -Steve
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