[gentoo-dev] virtual/libintl and virtual/iconv

[gentoo-dev] virtual/libintl and virtual/iconv

[Diego 'Flameeyes' Pettenò]

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That's another discussion birth from G/FreeBSD problems :)

First of all, a bit of introduction on what libintl and iconv are supposed to 
mean:

- libintl is a library which takes care of providing i18n support at runtime 
in applications. This is provided by glibc and probably uclibc on Linux 
systems.
- iconv() is a system function which provides charset conversions to programs. 
This is provided by glibc and uclibc probably, and by other libcs in other 
systems (aix?). *BSD libcs doesn't provide it directly, and some programs 
depends on GNU's implementation. For that, libiconv package was created and 
currently is used by G/FBSD systems.

Now, many ebuilds needs to add to their dependency libiconv and gettext (to 
RDEPEND not just DEPEND) when they aren't used in glibc/uclibc systems.
As this is nasty to add, a solution could be to create two more virtuals, 
provided by glibc and uclibc on Linux systems and by profile on OSX (at least 
for libiconv I think it's already in place), and provided also by gettext and 
libiconv in G/Fbsd (for example).

How good this solution can be?

-- 
Diego "Flameeyes" Pettenò
Gentoo Developer (Gentoo/FreeBSD, Video, Gentoo/AMD64)

http://dev.gentoo.org/~flameeyes/


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Re: [gentoo-dev] virtual/libintl and virtual/iconv

[Mike Frysinger]

On Friday 06 May 2005 06:32 pm, Diego 'Flameeyes' Pettenò wrote:
> How good this solution can be?

can you explain why my previous solution of assuming libc provided NLS 
capabilities wasnt good enough ?
-mike

-- 
gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list

Re: [gentoo-dev] virtual/libintl and virtual/iconv

[Ciaran McCreesh]

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On Sat, 7 May 2005 00:32:41 +0200 "Diego 'Flameeyes' Pettenò"
<flameeyes@gentoo.org> wrote:
| Now, many ebuilds needs to add to their dependency libiconv and
| gettext (to  RDEPEND not just DEPEND) when they aren't used in
| glibc/uclibc systems. As this is nasty to add, a solution could be to
| create two more virtuals,  provided by glibc and uclibc on Linux
| systems and by profile on OSX (at least  for libiconv I think it's
| already in place), and provided also by gettext and  libiconv in
| G/Fbsd (for example).

virtual/gettext-runtime or the like? Personally I'd prefer that you
waited for the virtuals GLEP. See, then we could have a virtual/gettext,
which does something like:

DEPEND="sys-apps/gettext"
RDEPEND="
    elibc_glibc?  ( virtual/glibc )
    elibc_uclibc? ( sys-libs/uclibc )
    elibc_bsd?    ( sys-apps/gettext )"

or whatever. One virtual. Far nicer. Anyway, whatever you decide upon,
let me know so that I can get it in The Doc...

-- 
Ciaran McCreesh : Gentoo Developer (Vim, Shell tools, Fluxbox, Cron)
Mail            : ciaranm at gentoo.org
Web             : http://dev.gentoo.org/~ciaranm


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Re: [gentoo-dev] virtual/libintl and virtual/iconv

[Diego 'Flameeyes' Pettenò]

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On Saturday 07 May 2005 00:46, Mike Frysinger wrote:
> can you explain why my previous solution of assuming libc provided NLS
> capabilities wasnt good enough ?
Because they don't. Simple.

And I don't like the idea of forcing into system gettext and libiconv, as they 
aren't needed for *all* the software out there, you can still have many 
packages without using them. I really needed to install them just for glib2 
initially, and I was having already a few packages installed for example 
subversion.

And I'm in ideas of "the least, the better" wrt dependencies.

-- 
Diego "Flameeyes" Pettenò
Gentoo Developer (Gentoo/FreeBSD, Video, Gentoo/AMD64)

http://dev.gentoo.org/~flameeyes/


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Re: [gentoo-dev] virtual/libintl and virtual/iconv

[Diego 'Flameeyes' Pettenò]

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On Saturday 07 May 2005 00:49, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> Personally I'd prefer that you waited for the virtuals GLEP.
Well it's not exactly something sooo urgent.. as we are working out of main 
tree we can just say users "install libiconv and gettext if you want to 
compile XXX". But to get the more of our overlay into main tree, I'd like to 
have at least the main packages fixed soon. What is the expected timeframe 
for that GLEP?

> Anyway, whatever you decide upon,
> let me know so that I can get it in The Doc...
How can you get it in something which doesn't exists? :)
* still tricked by Jedis' powers.... *

-- 
Diego "Flameeyes" Pettenò
Gentoo Developer (Gentoo/FreeBSD, Video, Gentoo/AMD64)

http://dev.gentoo.org/~flameeyes/


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Re: [gentoo-dev] virtual/libintl and virtual/iconv

[Mike Frysinger]

On Friday 06 May 2005 06:56 pm, Diego 'Flameeyes' Pettenò wrote:
> On Saturday 07 May 2005 00:46, Mike Frysinger wrote:
> > can you explain why my previous solution of assuming libc provided NLS
> > capabilities wasnt good enough ?
>
> And I don't like the idea of forcing into system gettext and libiconv, as
> they aren't needed for *all* the software out there, you can still have
> many packages without using them. I really needed to install them just for
> glib2 initially, and I was having already a few packages installed for
> example subversion.

i didnt mean force gettext since we already track that so much in ebuilds, but 
having something like 'nls? ( libiconv )' in a libc's PDEPEND doesnt seem 
like such a bad idea to me

> And I'm in ideas of "the least, the better" wrt dependencies.

so instead you suggest updating a crap ton of ebuilds with a bunch of libiconv 
DEPENDs ?
-mike

-- 
gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list

Re: [gentoo-dev] virtual/libintl and virtual/iconv

[Diego 'Flameeyes' Pettenò]

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On Saturday 07 May 2005 01:07, Mike Frysinger wrote:
> i didnt mean force gettext since we already track that so much in ebuilds,
> but having something like 'nls? ( libiconv )' in a libc's PDEPEND doesnt
> seem like such a bad idea to me
nls useflag is misused in that case, as freebsd-* packages already have a nls 
useflag for other stuff, and it would be anyway a problem for packages like 
glib2 which needs gettext also if nls is disabled.

> so instead you suggest updating a crap ton of ebuilds with a bunch of
> libiconv DEPENDs ?
That's just making sure that the depends are correct. We have packages 
depending on libc, also.

-- 
Diego "Flameeyes" Pettenò
Gentoo Developer (Gentoo/FreeBSD, Video, Gentoo/AMD64)

http://dev.gentoo.org/~flameeyes/


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Re: [gentoo-dev] virtual/libintl and virtual/iconv

[Mike Frysinger]

On Friday 06 May 2005 07:16 pm, Diego 'Flameeyes' Pettenò wrote:
> We have packages depending on libc, also.

funny you should mention that as i've been slowly deleting the 'virtual/libc' 
DEPEND from ebuilds as i see it

if ciaran's GLEP handles this crap cleanly, then i say we go with that
-mike

-- 
gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list

Re: [gentoo-dev] virtual/libintl and virtual/iconv

[Diego 'Flameeyes' Pettenò]

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On Saturday 07 May 2005 01:31, Mike Frysinger wrote:
> funny you should mention that as i've been slowly deleting the
> 'virtual/libc' DEPEND from ebuilds as i see it
Quite fair this.
Well okay, we'll wait for ciaran's GLEP :)

-- 
Diego "Flameeyes" Pettenò
Gentoo Developer (Gentoo/FreeBSD, Video, Gentoo/AMD64)

http://dev.gentoo.org/~flameeyes/


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Re: [gentoo-dev] virtual/libintl and virtual/iconv

[Ciaran McCreesh]

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On Fri, 6 May 2005 19:31:02 -0400 Mike Frysinger <vapier@gentoo.org>
wrote:
| On Friday 06 May 2005 07:16 pm, Diego 'Flameeyes' Pettenò wrote:
| > We have packages depending on libc, also.
| 
| funny you should mention that as i've been slowly deleting the
| 'virtual/libc'  DEPEND from ebuilds as i see it
| 
| if ciaran's GLEP handles this crap cleanly, then i say we go with that

Not my GLEP, jstubbs'. I just thought of a slightly weird way of abusing
the new functionality it offers, which he'll either like or kill me for.

-- 
Ciaran McCreesh : Gentoo Developer (Vim, Shell tools, Fluxbox, Cron)
Mail            : ciaranm at gentoo.org
Web             : http://dev.gentoo.org/~ciaranm


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Re: [gentoo-dev] virtual/libintl and virtual/iconv

[Jason Stubbs]

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On Saturday 07 May 2005 08:42, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> On Fri, 6 May 2005 19:31:02 -0400 Mike Frysinger <vapier@gentoo.org>
>
> wrote:
> | On Friday 06 May 2005 07:16 pm, Diego 'Flameeyes' Pettenò wrote:
> | > We have packages depending on libc, also.
> |
> | funny you should mention that as i've been slowly deleting the
> | 'virtual/libc'  DEPEND from ebuilds as i see it
> |
> | if ciaran's GLEP handles this crap cleanly, then i say we go with that
>
> Not my GLEP, jstubbs'. I just thought of a slightly weird way of abusing
> the new functionality it offers, which he'll either like or kill me for.

Nope. That's exactly the intention of making regular DEPEND syntax available.

Regards,
Jason Stubbs

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