From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21441 invoked by uid 1002); 15 Jul 2003 05:29:23 -0000 Mailing-List: contact gentoo-dev-help@gentoo.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@gentoo.org Received: (qmail 6127 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2003 05:29:22 -0000 Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2003 00:29:22 -0500 From: splite To: Kumba Cc: gentoo-dev@gentoo.org Message-ID: <20030715002922.E12388@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> References: <20030714214621.33b75fbd.zhen@gentoo.org> <20030714220238.B12388@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> <20030714230801.6688ba3f.zhen@gentoo.org> <20030714231534.C12388@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> <3F138938.8030105@gentoo.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <3F138938.8030105@gentoo.org>; from kumba@gentoo.org on Tue, Jul 15, 2003 at 12:55:20AM -0400 X-Disclaimer: Any similarity to an opinion of Purdue is purely coincidental Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Gentoo part II. X-Archives-Salt: ebe73a76-1823-4c50-a823-d1aec4bc138a X-Archives-Hash: f363eeea7ad942bdeb6e55e42d3ecf2f On Tue, Jul 15, 2003 at 12:55:20AM -0400, Kumba wrote: > [...] > Satire can be good satire or bad satire. It's all about how you phrase it. Actually, it's in how one reads it. Guess I should have used more smileys; all the great satirists do. Mark Twain was famous for it: "The political and commercial morals of the United States are not merely food for laughter, they are an entire banquet. :)" -- Mark Twain in Eruption > All the things zhen proposed were merely proposals. They are not > anything concrete or set in stone. It is probable that any proposals > made by zhen may have all live through debate to see the light of day, I thought we were debating. Now we're debating about how to debate. > or all may be consigned to bitrot in /dev/null. It is also probable > that some (but not all) of his proposals may survive. Who knows? What > matters is they were just that -- Proposals. Ideas. > > Because of the fact that they were just proposals, I think the way you > made your point was perhaps a bit harsh, and a bit uneccessary. There But more fun. Should using Gentoo be fun, but discussing it not be? > are better ways to say things w/o satiraclly picking apart every single > sentence to expose any possible flaws. You could have been much more I wasn't picking apart anything, really. I disagree with the lot. Mr. Davis carefully structured his proposal; my reply merely reflected that structure. > polite in stating your belief of why Gentoo should steer clear of such > ideas to avoid becoming the next Debian. Man, if you guys want to be in politics, you need to develop thicker hides. :) (Notice the smiley, your key to good satire.) > You're absolutely right on several things here. Flamewars suck, so lets > not turn this discussion into one. Second, Gentoo is indeed very fun. It hasn't been so far. Nobody's parentage has been questioned, and Hitler hasn't been invoked once. (I did use "fascist", but not in reference to Mr. Davis.) > I was drawn to Gentoo because of the community atmosphere, and because > developers were friendly to users. Even to users who are using Gentoo > as their very first Gentoo install. This alone shows the vastly > different attitude within Gentoo when compared to other distributions > and other OSS OSes. > > I don't see Gentoo becoming heavily politicized. But I do feel Gentoo I hope not, otherwise you'll see it forking into "Fun Gentoo" and "Structured Gentoo". Guess where the hackers will go. > needs better structuring as an organization. Why? Whose needs aren't being met? Gang, the NYSE isn't depending on you to fix a broken XMMS ebuild so that the Exchange can open in the morning. Nobody's pacemaker is in danger of failing because mod_ssl doesn't work on SPARC. If Joe Bob is running his business on Gentoo but doesn't have the skills to fix things himself, he should buy SuSE or Red Hat and a support contract. You don't owe him anything. > Several of the ideas > proposed by zhen could very well assist that. I'm quite sure if any of > his proposals are found to be incompatible with how Gentoo structures > itself, they will be summarily tossed aside and forgotten in the annals > of time. No need to lash out with such ferocity at mere concepts, ideas That was hardly lashing. "You suck!" would have been lashing. > that haven't even been discussed/debated yet. Simply state your opinion > of said ideas, Did that. > and back them up with proper logical reasoning. That is the most any of > us can hope to do. Nothing I said was illogical. "The small green lintball in my navel told me that expecting Linux geeks to adhere to Robert's Rules of Order is utterly daft" would be illogical. -- gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list