From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: <gentoo-dev-return-12619-arch-gentoo-dev=gentoo.org@lists.gentoo.org> Received: (qmail 25203 invoked from network); 19 May 2004 17:26:38 +0000 Received: from smtp.gentoo.org (156.56.111.197) by parrot.ussg.indiana.edu with SMTP; 19 May 2004 17:26:38 +0000 Received: from parrot.ussg.indiana.edu ([156.56.111.196] helo=parrot.gentoo.org) by smtp.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1BQUpw-0007Sl-TI for arch-gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org; Wed, 19 May 2004 17:26:37 +0000 Received: (qmail 15790 invoked by uid 89); 19 May 2004 17:26:36 +0000 Mailing-List: contact gentoo-dev-help@gentoo.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Post: <mailto:gentoo-dev@gentoo.org> List-Help: <mailto:gentoo-dev-help@gentoo.org> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:gentoo-dev-unsubscribe@gentoo.org> List-Subscribe: <mailto:gentoo-dev-subscribe@gentoo.org> List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail <gentoo-dev.gentoo.org> X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@gentoo.org Received: (qmail 25450 invoked from network); 19 May 2004 17:26:36 +0000 Date: Wed, 19 May 2004 19:26:34 +0200 (CEST) From: Olivier Crete <tester@gentoo.org> In-reply-to: <20040519160613.GA17836@cerberus.oppresses.us> To: avenj@gentoo.org Cc: foser@gentoo.org, gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Message-id: <1412.213.101.226.144.1084987594.squirrel@TesterServ.TesterNet> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: SquirrelMail (version 1.2.6) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <200405180034.30388.stuart@gentoo.org> <200405181845.58966.stuart@gentoo.org> <20040518201628.703a7b34@sven.genone.homeip.net> <200405182108.42231.stuart@gentoo.org> <1084966200.9124.18.camel@rivendell> <20040519160613.GA17836@cerberus.oppresses.us> Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: [gentoo-web-user] Hardened PHP now in Gentoo X-Archives-Salt: 9060e94b-8d88-4e3b-a512-609f4d0df1b1 X-Archives-Hash: 619ce450db92bc6e5cf14b0c78f37e44 > On Wed, May 19, 2004 at 01:30:00PM +0200, foser wrote: >> On Tue, 2004-05-18 at 21:08 +0100, Stuart Herbert wrote: >> >> > I'm pro-choice, and do not agree with the idea of aggregating USE >> > flags just because they sound similar. >> >> The second time you mention choice. I guess we know what Gentoo is >> about by now, the 'choice' argument is too often used just to end >> criticism. >> >> Choice is an illusion, if you there's too much choice it is no use to >> anyone anymore, because nobody really knows what it is all about. This >> is already the case with the loads of USE flags/portage options/etc. >> we have. Gentoo shouldn't be about choice for the sake of it, it >> should be about simplicity/managability : stuff that works. It's a >> trade-off. >> >> I wasn't too happy with the introducation of local USE flags for just >> the reasons that are becoming a problem now. Too much flags, everybody >> adds them at will without good reasons. We used to just say to people >> who wanted a specific (rare) set-up that they could easily edit the >> ebuild themselves to their need, but nowadays it seems we have to hold >> hands all the time and add complexity for nothing. That's good for >> nobody really. The installation manual used to be like 5 pages, by now >> it's a book of it's own per arch. I don't think that's a good thing >> and we should be really, really careful about what we can do to stop >> this movement. >> >> - foser > > The users seem to be perfectly happy with having a maximum of choice > via local USE flags. Most people are also okay with the handbook. So > what's the problem, exactly? Should we force everyone to do what _you_ > want rather than what _they_ want? There is at least one other guy who thinks that the handbook has gotten way too long (me)...And foser is right on choice, too much is worst that too little, because you end up not being able to find out howto where to configure stuff.. Gentoo is all about choice and choice is good.. But I dont want to have to go thourhg 800 use flags before I can install a gentoo system.. I used to be able to run ufed and set all of the use flags that I wanted for a system... I tried doing that yesterday.. the list has just gotten out of proportion. -- Olivier Crete tester@gentoo.org Gentoo Developer -- gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list