From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E3F3A1387FD for ; Wed, 2 Apr 2014 13:44:54 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 87D38E0BDF; Wed, 2 Apr 2014 13:44:47 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp.gentoo.org (smtp.gentoo.org [140.211.166.183]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7911EE0B99 for ; Wed, 2 Apr 2014 13:44:46 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [192.168.88.43] (unknown [96.241.16.8]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: tetromino) by smtp.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4376533F922; Wed, 2 Apr 2014 13:44:45 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <1396446235.20406.34.camel@rook> Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Stable masks on multilib packages From: Alexandre Rostovtsev To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Cc: multilib@gentoo.org Date: Wed, 02 Apr 2014 09:43:55 -0400 In-Reply-To: References: <20140401001617.42fdc3bc@pomiot.lan> <1396360717.20406.12.camel@rook> Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg="pgp-sha1"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="=-ufFDjGkMXONFHTt75QFf" X-Mailer: Evolution 3.10.4 Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Archives-Salt: fe25297c-e8bb-43a4-91fe-1f482f1e49da X-Archives-Hash: 656f336527f27ea23e9205d29683c8eb --=-ufFDjGkMXONFHTt75QFf Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Wed, 2014-04-02 at 17:14 +0800, Ben de Groot wrote: > On 1 April 2014 21:58, Alexandre Rostovtsev wrote: > > On Tue, 2014-04-01 at 13:13 +0800, Ben de Groot wrote: > >> On 1 April 2014 06:16, Micha=C5=82 G=C3=B3rny wrot= e: > >> > Hello, all. > >> > > >> > The late multilib ppc issues made me re-check our stable masks on > >> > abi_x86_* flags and, honestly, I'm not sure if we're doing things > >> > the right way. > >> > > >> > That said, I have an alternate idea inspired by the ppc breakage. > >> > > >> > Your thoughts? > >> > >> In my opinion your multilib approach introduces an unnecessary degree > >> of complexity, which --as has been shown here again-- is prone to > >> breakage. > >> > >> It would be best for our beloved distro to revert all the multilib > >> changes, and try a different approach, or leave this prone-to-breakage > >> implementation to an overlay for the few people who would actually > >> benefit from it. > > > > Speaking as a wine maintainer, the emul-linux-x86-* approach has many > > times been proven to be an embarrassing failure and the main source of > > pain and frustration for wine users. The sooner emul-linux-x86-* can be > > removed from the tree, the better for Gentoo. >=20 > I would like to see an honest cost-benefit analysis of the > emul-linux-x86 approach compared to the multilib eclass approach. > Because in my experience the latter introduces more breakage and > higher maintenance costs. libfoo-1.5 becomes available ~arch. Users install it. Users realize that libfoo-1.5's headers are incompatible with libfoo-1.4 binaries from emul-linux-x86-bar after they try to build wine and get a failure 30 minutes into the compile. So users complain about gentoo's wine support. libfoo-1.5 is stabilized. Of course, emul-linux-x86-bar has not been updated immediately, because *all* parts of emul-linux-x86 need to be updated at once due to a complex network of library interdependencies, and then manually checked for sanity, and the folks taking care of emul-linux-x86 can only really afford to do it 2, max 3 times per year. So more users install libfoo-1.5, and see wine fail, and complain more about gentoo's wine support until a new emul-linux-x86 release is rolled out a couple months later. But meanwhile, libbaz-5.0 becomes available in ~arch, and its headers are backwards-incompatible with libbaz-4.2 binaries in emul-linux-x86-wombatlibs... And this happens, oh, only every time there are API changes in libpng, jpeg, llvm, gnutls, libxml2, pulseaudio, etc. --=-ufFDjGkMXONFHTt75QFf Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) iQIcBAABAgAGBQJTPBQbAAoJEKRDAQ9PHUhgDeEQALsoa170ndxpyHTg5r9oNdPw GNy2VsDqV8BtMOPlSFC8ahMyHIcecrLWvhnwSABqbIMv/iVqYhW5TpUsXJVsKhnX jmE873EMriANw/u9wy65kPK4Bt8PK50Fe3Nk/BCKnCLzL7skkzH0CYYjGR3VRYZv KfegWHD8YPN53pHrlJzxaLVXDdTgKXevOimjHu3X6B4oeDV+5imFux0ESoO3dRqf VjnWmMAbMO/bRmVvs6a6zzYFzm0iF2PzOuwgqtDfpnNKUnyZTQGC2flUmZX/qahW xkFX5uQcU3h04vYdvKy45F9cm8a+7W1zTYFAFOYCgUnK++QDHOyGYb3fc0JwokYU DiCUnAYWPBySHOhNzOpFKDd/JcHpq1YmewZ2vTt1mAGRLjBVzYOTQ5q9sg2k50Tz lf3ksbGyP9MyLQY5T4mFp2vqRYaWwOq73cEPRtCXbF4M/YRHaegJs8Z/p6+qQS3a 0Mguy0LU/WbcSn5J6x/ZWH/77PBmsOt4h90yh/SdM4Fuko452gYnWJeI+JdmaLnl 3mbvZRYblZr0F+ZQG8RXHdkTSmOB0PKuTYR+AOa0XYTXXHYhA578E8JEwTDgxRN0 c2EwKcvo9NxMf7Sd2+dhHXno6QNbqBT3d/xs56JKtJ5z7QP9NpuMlSwuB8aBQ6kJ Ru6Yk0bNAb1IacwXMvLw =+Z6X -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-ufFDjGkMXONFHTt75QFf--