From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: <gentoo-dev+bounces-53877-garchives=archives.gentoo.org@lists.gentoo.org> Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06DF113800E for <garchives@archives.gentoo.org>; Wed, 8 Aug 2012 14:52:56 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id C988C21C00A; Wed, 8 Aug 2012 14:52:17 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp-out.neti.ee (smtp-out.neti.ee [194.126.126.41]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A467E0979 for <gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org>; Wed, 8 Aug 2012 14:48:43 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vm-relay5.estpak.ee (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC7F2542 for <gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org>; Wed, 8 Aug 2012 17:48:42 +0300 (EEST) X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at vm-relay5.estpak.ee Received: from smtp-out.neti.ee ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (vm-relay5.estpak.ee [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id VyrZZMdTDUC7 for <gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org>; Wed, 8 Aug 2012 17:48:36 +0300 (EEST) Received: from mail.neti.ee (neti-relayhost2.estpak.ee [88.196.174.199]) by vm-relay5.estpak.ee (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC675FA for <gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org>; Wed, 8 Aug 2012 17:48:36 +0300 (EEST) Received-SPF: Neutral (access neither permitted nor denied) identity=mailfrom; client-ip=88.196.20.50; helo=[192.168.1.71]; envelope-from=leio@gentoo.org; receiver=gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org X-SMTP-Auth-NETI-Businessmail: no Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Global Systemd USE Flag From: Mart Raudsepp <leio@gentoo.org> To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org In-Reply-To: <CAHmME9q=rt1SAsO4BnyB8_ebb=0pcCJUNJezb7dr6s631Qr5Dg@mail.gmail.com> References: <CAHmME9qUscF5U8tz1U-ff-Gx8Gb_8=UaUAJ4SAfOiNCuP_Z4=A@mail.gmail.com> <20120808161551.425c8e62@pomiocik.lan> <CAHmME9rxhDB=k6d6s4fbs32p8+6Zy6OuOweZN_T33PzinxKVgA@mail.gmail.com> <20120808163359.305604e9@pomiocik.lan> <CAHmME9q=rt1SAsO4BnyB8_ebb=0pcCJUNJezb7dr6s631Qr5Dg@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2012 17:48:32 +0300 Message-Id: <1344437312.19294.13.camel@phoenix.lan> Precedence: bulk List-Post: <mailto:gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org> List-Help: <mailto:gentoo-dev+help@lists.gentoo.org> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:gentoo-dev+unsubscribe@lists.gentoo.org> List-Subscribe: <mailto:gentoo-dev+subscribe@lists.gentoo.org> List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail <gentoo-dev.gentoo.org> X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.24.5 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Archives-Salt: bc8abcb3-a264-4beb-ae30-3a8418cdc475 X-Archives-Hash: a5901605598c0099f4693d235480c21c On N, 1970-01-01 at 00:00 +0000, Jason A. Donenfeld wrote: > On Wed, Aug 8, 2012 at 4:33 PM, Michał Górny <mgorny@gentoo.org> wrote: > > You are right. In case users really intend to use that, they may be > > better using app-portage/install-mask, and: > > > > $ install-mask -a systemd > > > > which will add just the right path. > > Still misses the point. USE flags were invented to deal with these > options. On a default install, which uses OpenRC, users shouldn't have > to then emerge an additional program to add more configuration in > order to have a clean system. USE flags are not meant for controlling every little thing, such as conditional installing a 400 byte file that does no harm when not used, other than taking 1 block of filesystem space (4kB or so), which can be workarounded by INSTALL_MASK if you are building an embedded system. I seriously doubt they were invented for such a purpose, but rather to control ./configure arguments and external dependencies. No, wanting to get rid of those on a desktop/server via a USE flag (as opposed to an INSTALL_MASK) is not a consideration, as that's users completely unneeded desire for no technical reason. If taking 500kB total for systemd service files is an issue, then the issue really is that you are using a 1GB /usr partition or something. This all is similar to how we in GNOME unconditionally install user and developer documentation, as long as it does not impose any extra build time or downloads. (no, this is not really negotiable for change, and we are talking about more than 400 byte files here; we'd be happy however if portage binary packages supported splitting of the source packages files to separate packages, so that binary distribution derivatives could work in a similar model as purely binary distributions) USE flags typically control the functionality of compiled binaries, usually involving external dependencies to achieve such extra functionality. http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/handbook/handbook-x86.xml?part=2&chap=2#doc_chap1_sect2 Best Regards, Mart Raudsepp