From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org ([208.92.234.80] helo=lists.gentoo.org) by finch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1O1Gnp-0002PB-9I for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Mon, 12 Apr 2010 10:23:38 +0000 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id A7018E07CF; Mon, 12 Apr 2010 10:23:31 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smarthost01.mail.zen.net.uk (smarthost01.mail.zen.net.uk [212.23.3.140]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 092A7E07C5 for ; Mon, 12 Apr 2010 10:23:15 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [62.3.120.141] (helo=NeddySeagoon) by smarthost01.mail.zen.net.uk with esmtps (TLS-1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1O1GnR-0007P5-Sh for gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org; Mon, 12 Apr 2010 10:23:14 +0000 Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2010 11:23:06 +0100 From: Roy Bamford Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Who is willing to be lead? To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org In-Reply-To: <201004101700.57748.hwoarang@gentoo.org> (from hwoarang@gentoo.org on Sat Apr 10 15:00:53 2010) X-Mailer: Balsa 2.4.1 Message-Id: <1271067793.3147.0@NeddySeagoon> Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=PGP-SHA1; boundary="=-B6KaewO7dtPKu/WKSdd8" X-Originating-Smarthost01-IP: [62.3.120.141] X-Archives-Salt: e85c2385-cb9a-4fd1-81b9-4e35dc8a03cc X-Archives-Hash: 3e46343798b683ceec7b4d18cc74b204 --=-B6KaewO7dtPKu/WKSdd8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 2010.04.10 15:00, Markos Chandras wrote: > On Saturday 10 April 2010 16:53:48 Petteri R=E4ty wrote: > > As people seem to want the council to take action I offer to take > > action. As it's impossible for me to do everything myself I offer=20 > to > act > > as a project manager/owner for people willing to donate their time > to > > whatever I see worthy for Gentoo as whole like the web page > redesign. > > Basically you tell me how many hours you have and I'll give you > stuff to > > work on. It might not be glorious at times like cleaning up a piece > of > > documentation but why not spend an hour a week on something that > > benefits the project? If people are interested, I'll work out the > details. > >=20 > > Regards, > > Petteri > That's not a good reaction from your side. Independent projects can > handle the=20 > incoming manpower themselves.=20 >=20 [snip] > --=20 > Markos Chandras (hwoarang) > Gentoo Linux Developer > Web: http://hwoarang.silverarrow.org >=20 There are two valuable non conflicting ideas here. The second one is=20 more obvious, so I'll address that first an show how it fits with the=20 other. =20 "Independent projects" Gentoo is an assemblage of independent projects=20 all pretty much doing their own thing ... the council exists to=20 "handle global issues" [glep39] This implies that the council works on things brought to its=20 attention, further its purpose is not to 'lead' (whatever that might=20 mean), rather its the glue that holds the independent projects=20 together when they can't resolve things for themselves. The problem with this structure is that the independent projects have=20 gaps/overlaps between them. Overlaps normally indicate wasted effort,=20 gaps indicate something missing that does not fit into the existing=20 projects (at least, as far as the projects are concerned). The result=20 is that the gaps are not addressed. Petteri, writes "I offer to take action". That's an offer from an=20 individual Gentoo developer, not on behalf of the council. It doesn't=20 matter how Petteri came to form his view that a lot of small tasks can=20 make Gentoo better for being organised. It need not encroach on the=20 independent projects at all. Gentoo has got to the social complexity now that it needs some middle=20 management. The council is not permitted to provide that and Petteri=20 has offered to try. Its really no different to putting up a project page and starting a new=20 project. This could be a new way to get non-devs involved too. Give them a small=20 well defined package of work to contribute ...=20 I see it in a positive light but I don't think I can offer any time at=20 the moment. --=20 Regards, Roy Bamford (Neddyseagoon) a member of gentoo-ops forum-mods trustees --=-B6KaewO7dtPKu/WKSdd8 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.14 (GNU/Linux) iEYEABECAAYFAkvC9JEACgkQTE4/y7nJvavDtQCgrMLJqVEwhFyvLFMczj6TYUnc 29kAmQGbqdHW/X8HTakuH57qVzEFvFK7 =DKxQ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-B6KaewO7dtPKu/WKSdd8--