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From: Roy Bamford <neddyseagoon@gentoo.org>
To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org
Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Enough about GLEP5{4,5}
Date: Mon, 08 Jun 2009 21:20:48 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <1244492455.3420.0@NeddySeagoon> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20090608193522.751a66a3@snowcone> (from ciaran.mccreesh@googlemail.com on Mon Jun  8 19:35:22 2009)

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On 2009.06.08 19:35, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
[snip]

> Easily-extractable EAPI either has change scope limitations or a
> considerable performance impact.
That needs to be quantified. e.g. 20ms to 200ms is a factor of 10x but 
it would not be considered 'considerable'.
ms == 0.001 seconds

> 
> GLEP 55's getting nowhere because a small group of religious fanatics
> are doing anything they can to derail it because it came from "the
> wrong people".
[snip]

I don't accept that. as I said in -council last night. A good technical 
paper presents an impartial, convincing technial argument. Glep 55 
version 1.5 fails, as evidenced by the number of people who are not 
convinced that the problem it addresses exists, never mind the proposed 
solution.

There are several issues. Some with glep55 and some with the glep 
process. Glep 55 (any version) does not cover all the areas in 
http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/glep/glep-0001.html#what-belongs-in-a-
successful-glep and it needs to.

Glep 55 is a particularly complex glep. its not really suited to the 
current glep process which is written as if you agree everying during 
the process of writing the glep and its a done deal when it gets 
to council.

Glep 55 would benefit from being subject to the full rigours of the 
life cycle process, which has already started to happen. Council have 
agreed the problem is worth addressing. Thats the first step in the 
process.

We have several options to solve the acknowledged problem. Thats the 
next life cycle process step. They need to be presented first for peer 
review, then to council with some metrics on the bottlenecks of each.
That does not mean you need fully working solutions. With that 
information, one solution will be selected for implementaion.

Breaking the problem into small pieces and addressing each piece is the 
way complex problems are solved outside of Gentoo. At the top level its 
called Systems Engineering. 

I'm quite happy to do the editorial work but I need the facts to work 
with and after two years we still only have subjective assessments of 
the alternatives.

Glep55 will be rejected no matter who presents it and where the ideas 
come from if its presented on one piece, its just too much to take in 
in one go. The approvers need to poke at the glep as it develops, not 
be presented with a done deal.

> 
> -- 
> Ciaran McCreesh
> 

- -- 
Regards,

Roy Bamford
(NeddySeagoon) a member of
gentoo-ops
forum-mods
treecleaners
trustees
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  reply	other threads:[~2009-06-08 20:21 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 7+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2009-06-07 15:54 [gentoo-dev] Enough about GLEP5{4,5} Rémi Cardona
2009-06-07 16:16 ` Roy Bamford
     [not found]   ` <2144523.vh3QGIWsHC@news.friendly-coders.info>
2009-06-08 18:35     ` Ciaran McCreesh
2009-06-08 20:20       ` Roy Bamford [this message]
2009-06-08 20:41       ` Patrick Lauer
2009-06-08 21:03         ` Dawid Węgliński
2009-06-08 21:32           ` Ulrich Mueller

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