Re: [gentoo-dev] ML changes

[Chris Gianelloni <wolf31o2@gentoo.org>]

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On Thu, 2007-07-12 at 23:41 -0700, Peter Gordon wrote:
> Quite frankly, this (if passed) will be Gentoo's deathbed moment, and
> this mail will be one of my last from an official Gentoo account.

Sure.  Just like CoC.  Or PMS.  Or whatever the popular "Gentoo is
dying" topic was prior to that.

If you really feel that strongly about it, feel free to leave.  Better
yet, how about you move to France with the rest of the pussies..
(obligatory South Park quote)

Seriously, how about instead of these childish "if this happens, I'm
taking my toys and going home" attitudes, you instead try to determine
what you can do to improve a situation you see as bad for Gentoo with
one you see as positive.  I've grown sick of all this talk and would
really like to see some action from the peanut gallery.  I know this
might be too much to ask from the armchair Council, but one can dream,
can't they?

> For far too long the mailing lists, IRC channels, and other media of
> developer communication have been ridden with belligerent,
> inconsiderate, and often-accusatory postings. However, instead of
> removing the few who cause most (if not all) of this damage to Gentoo,
> we are further restricting its development.

Actually, I tend to agree with you.  The problem is that we really don't
have a way to say that "Gentoo, as a project, has decided that we don't
want these people" and get rid of them.  Rather, we have these policies
that tend to protect the guilty and harm the innocent.  We've become
much too bureaucratic.

How about as an outgoing final act for the current Council, we just ban
all the asshats from the list (via our own discretion) and we just see
how much nicer things are in the month before the next Council has their
meeting.  I'm willing to bet the new Council wouldn't reverse any of our
bans/whatever and we wouldn't need to enact this sort of crap.  It would
be much easier if we could just be like "hey buddy, you're a dick... we
don't want you here" and we got rid of those people.

Sure, they'll turn up somewhere else, but do I really give a crap if
some guy decides to start flaming on some barely-used list or even
outside Gentoo's infrastructure about how much we suck or how unfairly
we treated them?  We get enough of that crap as it is now, and I don't
see it impacting us much, if at all.  What *does* impact us severely is
the perception that we're not doing anything about our problems.  I
would much rather do something and be wrong than do nothing.  Doing
nothing is *guaranteed* to not solve anything.

<snip a bunch of crap about Gentoo dying like FreeBSD>

> I, for one, will personally stand against any such action on this list.
> If it comes down to it, I will personally approve _any_ non-spam posting
> to this list by _anyone_ for the sake of civil disobedience. I encourage
> others to take similar action. This type of administration cannot be
> allowed to establish itself as proper or "just" in any way.

Umm... so you just volunteered to do what we *want* you to do?  Good job
with that "civil disobedience" there, buddy.  :P

Can we get some more "civil disobedience" from the rest of you?  It will
definitely make this project a success and, I think, improve the general
attitude on this list.  That's right, folks!  We need more "civil
disobedience" in Gentoo!

-- 
Chris Gianelloni
Release Engineering Strategic Lead
Alpha/AMD64/x86 Architecture Teams
Games Developer/Council Member/Foundation Trustee
Gentoo Foundation

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