On Thu, 2006-01-05 at 15:51 +0000, Kurt Lieber wrote:
> On Thu, Jan 05, 2006 at 08:07:14AM -0500 or thereabouts, Chris Gianelloni wrote:
> > Sounds like you'd rather take Gentoo back a few years to the days before
> > Hardened/Embedded/Alt.  I guess we really should just be "Gentoo Linux"
> > and ignore all of the progress and work that has been made in all of
> > these other areas simply because it doesn't fit with your goals.  
> 
> I've never stated any specific goals.  I've simply said we should have
> some.  Please stop putting words in my mouth.

On Thu, 2006-01-05 at 03:58 +0000, Kurt Lieber wrote: 
> On Tue, Jan 03, 2006 at 01:17:06PM -0500 or thereabouts, Chris Gianelloni
> wrote:
> > Do you want to be a part of a project that doesn't allow you to
> > implement some cool new feature because it might make Gentoo slightly
> > harder to use for some people and that's against the mission statement
> > so not allowed?
> 
> Yes, absolutely.

That says to me exactly what I stated that you said.  Whether that was
your intention or not, I honestly do not know.  However, I am not
putting words into your mouth, I am simply restating what you are saying
after my interpretation of it.

On Thu, 2006-01-05 at 04:31 +0000, Kurt Lieber wrote:
> That person should figure out what Gentoo wants to be when it grows up.
> S/he should carefully consult the various stakeholders, look at the
> strengths/weaknesses of Gentoo as it stands currently and then figure out
> where the best direction is for it to proceed.  They should then be
> responsible for making sure everyone (and I mean *everyone*) executes
> according to this direction.  Folks who disagree with the vision will be
> able to go their own direction and start their own projects.  That's the
> beauty of the GPL.

Right here you are explicitly stating that *everyone* should follow the
party line.  How exactly is what I have said false when your own words
say it?

"Play ball or go home" comes to mind.

At any rate, I had already apologized for the impression that you were
given of me putting words into your mouth, however the continued attacks
afterwards have made me reconsider and decide to go back and quote your
*actual* words to keep from causing any confusion on the matter.

> > I'd like to also propose that we drop support for sparc, mips, sh, m68k,
> > s390, arm, and alpha, since they detract from our main goals of providing
> > amd64/ppc/x86 releases.  After all, who really uses those "other" arches
> > anyway but a bunch of guys that never have good ideas or improve quality
> > of the distribution as a whole and constantly distract us away from
> > getting anything constructive done?
> 
> straw man argument. Maybe the best direction for gentoo is focusing on
> embedded, maybe it's focusing on x86, maybe it's dropping Linux entirely
> and moving over to OpenSolaris and building tools around that.  I never
> stated any opinions in this area so why are you trying to state them for
> me? 

...and at what point in that paragraph did I say that you said any of
it?  Also, I'm finding it hilarious to notice that a fellow native
English-speaking American is unable to recognize good ol' sarcasm in its
simplest form.

> It's pathetic that we, as a distribution, cannot have a civil discussion of
> any kind.

We have them all the time.  We also have flame wars all the time.  It's
simply a matter of doing business with over 300 people with a vested
interest and countless numbers of users, all with differing opinions.

-- 
Chris Gianelloni
Release Engineering - Strategic Lead
x86 Architecture Team
Games - Developer
Gentoo Linux