From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from lists.gentoo.org ([140.105.134.102] helo=robin.gentoo.org) by nuthatch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1EefHj-000557-5m for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Tue, 22 Nov 2005 21:02:39 +0000 Received: from robin.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by robin.gentoo.org (8.13.5/8.13.5) with SMTP id jAML1rws021674; Tue, 22 Nov 2005 21:01:53 GMT Received: from smtp05.gnvlscdb.sys.nuvox.net (smtp.nuvox.net [64.89.70.9]) by robin.gentoo.org (8.13.5/8.13.5) with ESMTP id jAMKxwBN007939 for ; Tue, 22 Nov 2005 20:59:58 GMT Received: from cgianelloni.nuvox.net (216.215.202.4.nw.nuvox.net [216.215.202.4]) by smtp05.gnvlscdb.sys.nuvox.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with SMTP id jAML0PxU027605 for ; Tue, 22 Nov 2005 16:00:26 -0500 Received: by cgianelloni.nuvox.net (sSMTP sendmail emulation); Tue, 22 Nov 2005 15:58:51 -0500 Subject: Re: Re[2]: [gentoo-dev] Decision to remove stage1/2 from installation documentation From: Chris Gianelloni To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org In-Reply-To: <977302213.20051122211620@gentoo.org> References: <20051122144745.GR12982@mail.lieber.org> <438330E1.2000804@gentoo.org> <1132672527.27288.21.camel@cgianelloni.nuvox.net> <20051122180349.GC16984@bmb24.uth.tmc.edu> <1132686363.27288.79.camel@cgianelloni.nuvox.net> <20051122192808.GE16984@bmb24.uth.tmc.edu> <1132689436.27288.91.camel@cgianelloni.nuvox.net> <977302213.20051122211620@gentoo.org> Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="=-ry64iWzYJI+V3ef05Q0p" Organization: Gentoo Linux Date: Tue, 22 Nov 2005 15:58:50 -0500 Message-Id: <1132693131.27288.102.camel@cgianelloni.nuvox.net> Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.4.1 X-Archives-Salt: 52745308-0cce-4d60-bb1c-a83c9652d5cb X-Archives-Hash: 8ee86bccf93ffdd47977d9560af74308 --=-ry64iWzYJI+V3ef05Q0p Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Tue, 2005-11-22 at 21:16 +0100, Jakub Moc wrote: > 22.11.2005, 20:57:15, Chris Gianelloni wrote: >=20 > > The idea was to move out the stage1/stage2 docs to somewhere else. The= n > > create some sort of "Advanced Installation Topics" guide or something, = to > > list out the replacement procedures for customizing a system from a sta= ge3 > > tarball, then, eventually, drop the stage1 and stage2 tarballs. >=20 > Erm, did you read what solar wrote about hardened stages and why should s= tage1 > still stay? I read it. For one, I am speaking of the default stages for the releases. If the Hardened team decides that they would prefer to continue to offer a stage1 tarball, I wouldn't have a problem with that. While solar's reasoning applies fine to the Hardened releases, it doesn't apply to the default x86 releases, as we release on multiple sub-arches, which each have their proper CHOST settings. > > "A stage3 tarball is an archive containing a minimal Gentoo environment= , > > suitable to continue the Gentoo installation using the instructions in > > this manual. Previously, the Gentoo Handbook described the installation > > using one of three stage tarballs. While Gentoo still offers stage1 and > > stage2 tarballs, the official installation method uses the stage3 > > tarball. If you are interested in performing a Gentoo installation usin= g > > a stage1 or stage2 tarball, please read the Gentoo FAQ on How do I > > Install Gentoo Using a Stage1 or Stage2 Tarball?" >=20 > That FAQ section has nothing in common with the original stage1 docs. Sor= ry, > installing stage3 to remove all the use flags cruft subsequently, bootstr= ap and > re-emerge the system and then ponder which packages are not needed any mo= re > (again, there's no reliable tool to remove unneeded stuff from system, I'= ve > already mentioned this once) - hmmm... :/ No. That FAQ section is there to describe how to install from a stage1 or stage2 tarball and has nothing to do with a stage3 tarball, nor did I ever say that it would. I'm not sure I understand what you're getting at here. > And - once stages 1+2 are removed (as you are suggesting above), then I'l= l > install the system only to build my own stage1 w/ catalyst, then reformat= and > start over with my own stage? Ah, that makes live sooo much easier ;p You would be more than welcome to, but you would be wasting your time. I quite personally could care less if you wish to go through this process or not. The whole point here is in what we want to support. > > Really, everybody is just up in arms over a knee-jerk reaction to not > > reading carefully. What it boils down to is either not knowing the > > facts, or trolling/flaming. >=20 > Why exactly is evaporating stage1 an ultimate goal here (as it seems to m= e?). It's usefulness is far outweighed by the problems it causes, and it is really no longer necessary, nor has it been for over a year now. > So don't support it, but why it should not exist? I'll explain this just once. If we release it, we are expected to support it. There are *tons* of examples of things we won't do because we don't want the headache of supporting it. Why should this be any different? --=20 Chris Gianelloni Release Engineering - Strategic Lead x86 Architecture Team Games - Developer Gentoo Linux --=-ry64iWzYJI+V3ef05Q0p Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQBDg4aKkT4lNIS36YERAunxAJwMazmSQgaI3YR5YWnoDsN6J7dtYgCbBAd6 dw0EKOULc/QD1TgE9Ec17pE= =KCxE -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-ry64iWzYJI+V3ef05Q0p-- -- gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list