[gentoo-dev] Using cvs as your portage directory

[gentoo-dev] Using cvs as your portage directory

[Joel Martin]

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With the new developers today, I was inspired to finish this up and post
it. I have posted some notes (raw) for the process that I used to
transition from my rsynced portage dir, to my cvs portage tree:
http://dev.gentoo.org/~kanaka/dev_start.html

I searched for this info in docs but didn't find anything. I don't know
if this is the sanctioned method for doing things, but it has worked
well for me in the past couple of weeks. If people think it is a good
idea, perhaps it could be added to one of these docs:
http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/cvs-tutorial.xml
http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/policy.xml

Thoughts anyone? Especially from you new devs?

Joel Martin (kanaka)

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Using cvs as your portage directory

[Paul de Vrieze]

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On Tuesday 23 March 2004 23:25, Joel Martin wrote:
> With the new developers today, I was inspired to finish this up and post
> it. I have posted some notes (raw) for the process that I used to
> transition from my rsynced portage dir, to my cvs portage tree:
> http://dev.gentoo.org/~kanaka/dev_start.html
>
> I searched for this info in docs but didn't find anything. I don't know
> if this is the sanctioned method for doing things, but it has worked
> well for me in the past couple of weeks. If people think it is a good
> idea, perhaps it could be added to one of these docs:
> http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/cvs-tutorial.xml
> http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/policy.xml
>
> Thoughts anyone? Especially from you new devs?

I might want to state that I personally do not use cvs as my portage tree. I 
have several reasons for this that you might consider:
- It is allways an advantage to see what the user sees
- syncing up the whole tree is both slow and it puts an extra strain on
  cvs.gentoo.org
- It is very easy to accidentally commit temporary fixes you made in your life
  tree. (this was esp. true with regard to package.mask that now can be
  overridden without editing the life tree)

Personally I think the extra strain on cvs.gentoo.org and my patience is not 
necessary and I only update those parts of the cvs tree that I need to 
change.

Paul

-- 
Paul de Vrieze
Gentoo Developer
Mail: pauldv@gentoo.org
Homepage: http://www.devrieze.net

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Using cvs as your portage directory

[Stuart Herbert]

On Tuesday 23 March 2004 22:25, Joel Martin wrote:
> Thoughts anyone? Especially from you new devs?
>
> Joel Martin (kanaka)

One advantage is that you don't have to wait for an hour for the rsync mirrors 
to catch up with any commits you've made.

But the tree has reached the size where syncing the entire tree from CVS is 
very slow - and it must put a strain on the CVS server too.  I wonder if we 
should seriously start looking to migrate from CVS to something a little more 
network friendly ...

What would be great would be if Portage supported more than one 
PORTDIR_OVERLAY tree on the same box.  Then you can have a local Portage tree 
for developing new ebuilds, then the CVS one to commit and test in, and 
finally the rsync tree to catch all the ebuilds missing from the other two 
trees.  That sounds like it'd be a good compromise.

Best regards,
Stu
-- 
Stuart Herbert                                              stuart@gentoo.org
Gentoo Developer                                       http://www.gentoo.org/
Missed the php|cruise?             http://dev.gentoo.org/~stuart/cruise-2004/

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Using cvs as your portage directory

[Paul de Vrieze]

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On Tuesday 23 March 2004 23:54, Stuart Herbert wrote:
> What would be great would be if Portage supported more than one
> PORTDIR_OVERLAY tree on the same box.  Then you can have a local Portage
> tree for developing new ebuilds, then the CVS one to commit and test in,
> and finally the rsync tree to catch all the ebuilds missing from the other
> two trees.  That sounds like it'd be a good compromise.

portage actually supports multiple overlays. I don't know exactly how, but it 
does. Probably just adding the overlay to the variable with a space separator 
works.

Paul

-- 
Paul de Vrieze
Gentoo Developer
Mail: pauldv@gentoo.org
Homepage: http://www.devrieze.net

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Using cvs as your portage directory

[Stuart Herbert]

On Tuesday 23 March 2004 22:57, Paul de Vrieze wrote:
> portage actually supports multiple overlays. I don't know exactly how, but
> it does. Probably just adding the overlay to the variable with a space
> separator works.

Yup - space as the separator works.

I agree with Joel - it'd be worth someone adding some docs about this for new 
devs (and us older ones ;-) to read.

Best regards,
Stu
-- 
Stuart Herbert                                              stuart@gentoo.org
Gentoo Developer                                       http://www.gentoo.org/
Missed the php|cruise?             http://dev.gentoo.org/~stuart/cruise-2004/

GnuGP key id# F9AFC57C available from http://pgp.mit.edu
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[gentoo-dev] Re: Using cvs as your portage directory

[Michael Sterrett -Mr. Bones.-]

On Tue, 23 Mar 2004, Paul de Vrieze wrote:

> I might want to state that I personally do not use cvs as my portage tree. I 
> have several reasons for this that you might consider:

I do use cvs as my portage tree (on one of my gentoo boxes) so I'll offer
some counter points for discussion.

> - It is always an advantage to see what the user sees

I agree with this (except for the "always"), but I've also found it useful
to see now what the users *will* see shortly.  Several times this has
enabled me to fix things that would have been noticed by the users.

> - syncing up the whole tree is both slow and it puts an extra strain on
>   cvs.gentoo.org

My usual routine is this: I sync the whole tree in the middle of the
night and then only update the parts that are touched (by watching
#gentoo-commits) during the day (if at all).  I'm asleep when the full
sync goes so my level of patience isn't an issue and the updates during
the day shouldn't put an unreasonable strain on the server.

> - It is very easy to accidentally commit temporary fixes you made in your life
>   tree. (this was esp. true with regard to package.mask that now can be
>   overridden without editing the life tree)

I agree with this point, but I think it's highly dependent on the style
of development that you use.  I have maybe one or two changes to the
portage tree that I'm testing on this box at any given moment so it's
easy to not commit those changes.  There are quite a number of ebuilds
in my local portage tree that are "in progress" but since they haven't
been added to CVS yet, there's no risk of committing them.  Generally,
I don't leave edits in the tree uncommitted.

Michael Sterrett
  -Mr. Bones.-
mr_bones_@gentoo.org

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Using cvs as your portage directory

[Brandon Hale]

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On Tue, 2004-03-23 at 23:10 +0000, Stuart Herbert wrote:

This may or may not be of use to any of you, but here is how I do
things.. My main tree (/usr/portage) uses typical rsync, this is what I
sync nightly. Note that a nightly rsync update is less stressful on our
infrastructure as we have numerous mirrors for just this purpose. I have
an overlay in /usr/local/portage for things that I'm playing with but
have no intentions to commit. This is my PORTDIR_OVERLAY in make.conf.
Lastly, I have a cvs checkout of the tree in ~/work/gentoo-x86 to
develop against. If I want to test something in the tree, I can simply
pass PORTDIR_OVERLAY inline and override the variable in the environment
(this might be additive, doesnt matter either way), such as
`PORTDIR_OVERLAY="~/work/gentoo-x86" emerge foo`. With some $1 action,
this lends itself to a simple alias.

What are the pros? I have a complete and up to date tree w/o putting
unneeded stress on our infra. I also have a place for testing ebuilds I
am not ready to commit. And most importantly to me, I can also work on
the tree in CVS w/o any extra hassle. Any questions, or improvements on
the above feel free to drop me a line.

> On Tuesday 23 March 2004 22:57, Paul de Vrieze wrote:
> > portage actually supports multiple overlays. I don't know exactly how, but
> > it does. Probably just adding the overlay to the variable with a space
> > separator works.
> 
> Yup - space as the separator works.
> 
> I agree with Joel - it'd be worth someone adding some docs about this for new 
> devs (and us older ones ;-) to read.
> 
> Best regards,
> Stu
> -- 
> Stuart Herbert                                              stuart@gentoo.org
> Gentoo Developer                                       http://www.gentoo.org/
> Missed the php|cruise?             http://dev.gentoo.org/~stuart/cruise-2004/
> 
> GnuGP key id# F9AFC57C available from http://pgp.mit.edu
> Key fingerprint = 31FB 50D4 1F88 E227 F319  C549 0C2F 80BA F9AF C57C
> --
> 
> --
> gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list

-- 
Brandon Hale
Co-lead, Gentoo Desktop
Hardened Gentoo

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Using cvs as your portage directory

[Brandon Hale]

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On Tue, 2004-03-23 at 18:55 -0500, Brandon Hale wrote:

Another note to new developers considering a CVS only approach:
rsync mirrors distribute a partial Portage cache, cvs does not, so you
should be building this yourself via `emerge regen`. If you dont, things
will break in weird ways. Also, I highly advise against using CVS
checkout as a "real" overlay specified in make.conf.. this will force
Portage to rebuild the cache for this tree in addition to the rsync tree
and eat up cpu time needlessly.

> On Tue, 2004-03-23 at 23:10 +0000, Stuart Herbert wrote:
> 
> This may or may not be of use to any of you, but here is how I do
> things.. My main tree (/usr/portage) uses typical rsync, this is what I
> sync nightly. Note that a nightly rsync update is less stressful on our
> infrastructure as we have numerous mirrors for just this purpose. I have
> an overlay in /usr/local/portage for things that I'm playing with but
> have no intentions to commit. This is my PORTDIR_OVERLAY in make.conf.
> Lastly, I have a cvs checkout of the tree in ~/work/gentoo-x86 to
> develop against. If I want to test something in the tree, I can simply
> pass PORTDIR_OVERLAY inline and override the variable in the environment
> (this might be additive, doesnt matter either way), such as
> `PORTDIR_OVERLAY="~/work/gentoo-x86" emerge foo`. With some $1 action,
> this lends itself to a simple alias.
> 
> What are the pros? I have a complete and up to date tree w/o putting
> unneeded stress on our infra. I also have a place for testing ebuilds I
> am not ready to commit. And most importantly to me, I can also work on
> the tree in CVS w/o any extra hassle. Any questions, or improvements on
> the above feel free to drop me a line.
> 
> > On Tuesday 23 March 2004 22:57, Paul de Vrieze wrote:
> > > portage actually supports multiple overlays. I don't know exactly how, but
> > > it does. Probably just adding the overlay to the variable with a space
> > > separator works.
> > 
> > Yup - space as the separator works.
> > 
> > I agree with Joel - it'd be worth someone adding some docs about this for new 
> > devs (and us older ones ;-) to read.
> > 
> > Best regards,
> > Stu
> > -- 
> > Stuart Herbert                                              stuart@gentoo.org
> > Gentoo Developer                                       http://www.gentoo.org/
> > Missed the php|cruise?             http://dev.gentoo.org/~stuart/cruise-2004/
> > 
> > GnuGP key id# F9AFC57C available from http://pgp.mit.edu
> > Key fingerprint = 31FB 50D4 1F88 E227 F319  C549 0C2F 80BA F9AF C57C
> > --
> > 
> > --
> > gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list
> 
> -- 
> Brandon Hale
> Co-lead, Gentoo Desktop
> Hardened Gentoo

-- 
Brandon Hale
Co-lead, Gentoo Desktop
Hardened Gentoo

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Using cvs as your portage directory

[Chris Gianelloni]

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On Tue, 2004-03-23 at 18:55, Brandon Hale wrote:
> On Tue, 2004-03-23 at 23:10 +0000, Stuart Herbert wrote:
> 
> This may or may not be of use to any of you, but here is how I do
> things.. My main tree (/usr/portage) uses typical rsync, this is what I
> sync nightly. Note that a nightly rsync update is less stressful on our
> infrastructure as we have numerous mirrors for just this purpose. I have
> an overlay in /usr/local/portage for things that I'm playing with but
> have no intentions to commit. This is my PORTDIR_OVERLAY in make.conf.
> Lastly, I have a cvs checkout of the tree in ~/work/gentoo-x86 to
> develop against. If I want to test something in the tree, I can simply
> pass PORTDIR_OVERLAY inline and override the variable in the environment
> (this might be additive, doesnt matter either way), such as
> `PORTDIR_OVERLAY="~/work/gentoo-x86" emerge foo`. With some $1 action,
> this lends itself to a simple alias.
> 
> What are the pros? I have a complete and up to date tree w/o putting
> unneeded stress on our infra. I also have a place for testing ebuilds I
> am not ready to commit. And most importantly to me, I can also work on
> the tree in CVS w/o any extra hassle. Any questions, or improvements on
> the above feel free to drop me a line.

This is exactly what I do, minus the updating of my /usr/portage
nightly.  I probably only update once a week or so on most of my
machines, unless I am working on something specific which requires it.

I like to keep my trees separate, and even go so far as to keep a VMWare
image of x86 to fire up and test things on when I'm making changes to
the stable tree for x86 rather than ~x86.

-- 
Chris Gianelloni
Developer, Gentoo Linux
Games Team

Is your power animal a penguin?

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Using cvs as your portage directory

[Md Mooktakim Ahmed]

I was thinking. Wouldn't it be better if the portage tree was split into mutiple modules
in cvs?
That way you can update individual modules (or directories inside /usr/portage) at a
time. that means less stress on the server and you can work on the files you want, when
you want, fairly easily.

Just thinking it might be best to do that.


> On Tue, 2004-03-23 at 18:55, Brandon Hale wrote:
>> On Tue, 2004-03-23 at 23:10 +0000, Stuart Herbert wrote:
>>
>> This may or may not be of use to any of you, but here is how I do
>> things.. My main tree (/usr/portage) uses typical rsync, this is what I
>> sync nightly. Note that a nightly rsync update is less stressful on our
>> infrastructure as we have numerous mirrors for just this purpose. I have
>> an overlay in /usr/local/portage for things that I'm playing with but
>> have no intentions to commit. This is my PORTDIR_OVERLAY in make.conf.
>> Lastly, I have a cvs checkout of the tree in ~/work/gentoo-x86 to
>> develop against. If I want to test something in the tree, I can simply
>> pass PORTDIR_OVERLAY inline and override the variable in the environment
>> (this might be additive, doesnt matter either way), such as
>> `PORTDIR_OVERLAY="~/work/gentoo-x86" emerge foo`. With some $1 action,
>> this lends itself to a simple alias.
>>
>> What are the pros? I have a complete and up to date tree w/o putting
>> unneeded stress on our infra. I also have a place for testing ebuilds I
>> am not ready to commit. And most importantly to me, I can also work on
>> the tree in CVS w/o any extra hassle. Any questions, or improvements on
>> the above feel free to drop me a line.
>
> This is exactly what I do, minus the updating of my /usr/portage
> nightly.  I probably only update once a week or so on most of my
> machines, unless I am working on something specific which requires it.
>
> I like to keep my trees separate, and even go so far as to keep a VMWare
> image of x86 to fire up and test things on when I'm making changes to
> the stable tree for x86 rather than ~x86.
>
> --
> Chris Gianelloni
> Developer, Gentoo Linux
> Games Team
>
> Is your power animal a penguin?
>


----------------------------------------------------
Website: http://www.mooktakim.com
email: Mooktakim@hotmail.com

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Using cvs as your portage directory

[Jeremy Maitin-Shepard]

Using multiple CVS modules would have no effect on being able to update
individual portions of the tree.  Running cvs update in a subdirectory
already works fine.
-- 
Jeremy Maitin-Shepard

--
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Re: [gentoo-dev] Using cvs as your portage directory

[Md Mooktakim Ahmed]

ah well :) just a thought

I'm no cvs expert :D:D

> Using multiple CVS modules would have no effect on being able to update
> individual portions of the tree.  Running cvs update in a subdirectory
> already works fine.
> --
> Jeremy Maitin-Shepard
>
> --
> gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list
>
>


----------------------------------------------------
Website: http://www.mooktakim.com
email: Mooktakim@hotmail.com

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Using cvs as your portage directory

[Paul de Vrieze]

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Hash: SHA1

On Wednesday 24 March 2004 00:26, Michael Sterrett -Mr. Bones.- wrote:
> My usual routine is this: I sync the whole tree in the middle of the
> night and then only update the parts that are touched (by watching
> #gentoo-commits) during the day (if at all).  I'm asleep when the full
> sync goes so my level of patience isn't an issue and the updates
> during the day shouldn't put an unreasonable strain on the server.

Unfortunately your night is not my night ;-)

Paul

- -- 
Paul de Vrieze
Gentoo Developer
Mail: pauldv@gentoo.org
Homepage: http://www.devrieze.net
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Re: [gentoo-dev] Using cvs as your portage directory

[Paul de Vrieze]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Wednesday 24 March 2004 01:00, Brandon Hale wrote:
> On Tue, 2004-03-23 at 18:55 -0500, Brandon Hale wrote:
>
> Another note to new developers considering a CVS only approach:
> rsync mirrors distribute a partial Portage cache, cvs does not, so you
> should be building this yourself via `emerge regen`. If you dont,
> things will break in weird ways. Also, I highly advise against using
> CVS checkout as a "real" overlay specified in make.conf.. this will
> force Portage to rebuild the cache for this tree in addition to the
> rsync tree and eat up cpu time needlessly.

Btw. This is exactly the approach I use (with the alias for the inline 
tree)

Paul

- -- 
Paul de Vrieze
Gentoo Developer
Mail: pauldv@gentoo.org
Homepage: http://www.devrieze.net
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Re: [gentoo-dev] Using cvs as your portage directory

[Chris Gianelloni]

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On Tue, 2004-03-23 at 20:26, Md Mooktakim Ahmed wrote:
> I was thinking. Wouldn't it be better if the portage tree was split into mutiple modules
> in cvs?
> That way you can update individual modules (or directories inside /usr/portage) at a
> time. that means less stress on the server and you can work on the files you want, when
> you want, fairly easily.
> 
> Just thinking it might be best to do that.

cd /home/wolf31o2/cvsroot/gentoo-x86/games-fps
cvs up

That will update only that one area of portage from CVS.  That seems
simple enough.  I rarely update my entire tree, maybe once a month just
to keep it from becoming totally stale.  This also has me testing things
with older versions of packages to check if they work.  I tend to prefer
to put the lowest possible version allowable in *DEPEND that I can test
with and ensure works.

> > On Tue, 2004-03-23 at 18:55, Brandon Hale wrote:
> >> On Tue, 2004-03-23 at 23:10 +0000, Stuart Herbert wrote:
> >>
> >> This may or may not be of use to any of you, but here is how I do
> >> things.. My main tree (/usr/portage) uses typical rsync, this is what I
> >> sync nightly. Note that a nightly rsync update is less stressful on our
> >> infrastructure as we have numerous mirrors for just this purpose. I have
> >> an overlay in /usr/local/portage for things that I'm playing with but
> >> have no intentions to commit. This is my PORTDIR_OVERLAY in make.conf.
> >> Lastly, I have a cvs checkout of the tree in ~/work/gentoo-x86 to
> >> develop against. If I want to test something in the tree, I can simply
> >> pass PORTDIR_OVERLAY inline and override the variable in the environment
> >> (this might be additive, doesnt matter either way), such as
> >> `PORTDIR_OVERLAY="~/work/gentoo-x86" emerge foo`. With some $1 action,
> >> this lends itself to a simple alias.
> >>
> >> What are the pros? I have a complete and up to date tree w/o putting
> >> unneeded stress on our infra. I also have a place for testing ebuilds I
> >> am not ready to commit. And most importantly to me, I can also work on
> >> the tree in CVS w/o any extra hassle. Any questions, or improvements on
> >> the above feel free to drop me a line.
> >
> > This is exactly what I do, minus the updating of my /usr/portage
> > nightly.  I probably only update once a week or so on most of my
> > machines, unless I am working on something specific which requires it.
> >
> > I like to keep my trees separate, and even go so far as to keep a VMWare
> > image of x86 to fire up and test things on when I'm making changes to
> > the stable tree for x86 rather than ~x86.
> >
> > --
> > Chris Gianelloni
> > Developer, Gentoo Linux
> > Games Team
> >
> > Is your power animal a penguin?
> >
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------
> Website: http://www.mooktakim.com
> email: Mooktakim@hotmail.com
> 
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> --
> gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list
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Chris Gianelloni
Developer, Gentoo Linux
Games Team

Is your power animal a penguin?

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Using cvs as your portage directory

[Lars Weiler]

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* Stuart Herbert <stuart@gentoo.org> [04/03/23 22:54 +0000]:
> But the tree has reached the size where syncing the entire tree from CVS is 
> very slow - and it must put a strain on the CVS server too.  I wonder if we 
> should seriously start looking to migrate from CVS to something a little more 
> network friendly ...

Are you asking for something like cvsup [1]?

So, as there were more devs asking for it, we should find
out, if we can build up such a system.  Another advantage
would be distributing the tree on more than one system.

Testing cvsup is on my list for a long time, but it has not
a high priority.

Regards, Lars

[1] http://www.cvsup.org/

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Using cvs as your portage directory

[Nick Jones]

> Another note to new developers considering a CVS only approach:
> rsync mirrors distribute a partial Portage cache, cvs does not, so you
> should be building this yourself via `emerge regen`. If you dont, things
> will break in weird ways.

Full ebuild cache. The only generation is an eclass cross reference
table. Regen is absolutely not required... if there is something
affected by that, either the ebuild is broken or there is a bug
that needs to be reported.

> Also, I highly advise against using CVS
> checkout as a "real" overlay specified in make.conf.. this will force
> Portage to rebuild the cache for this tree in addition to the rsync tree
> and eat up cpu time needlessly.

Very true, but Nakano has an enhancement to caching in CVS and
testing portages that should kill this penalty for the most part.

CVS over rsync is a bad idea in general though. You're likely to
confuse yourself on which ebuild and eclasses are actually being
used to acquire data and handle the package. Overlays should only
be partial sets.

--NJ


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