From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 4.0.0 (2022-12-14) on finch.gentoo.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.9 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_ADSP_NXDOMAIN, DMARC_MISSING,MAILING_LIST_MULTI,NICE_REPLY_A,RDNS_DYNAMIC autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no version=4.0.0 Received: from wired-networks.net (213-145-191-67.dd.nextgentel.com [213.145.191.67]) by chiba.3jane.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 1BC3E201CEA8 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 15:25:53 -0500 (CDT) Received: (qmail 31987 invoked from network); 8 Apr 2002 20:25:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO maas) (192.168.0.2) by aleph.wired with SMTP; 8 Apr 2002 20:25:32 -0000 Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] FAQ From: Erik Grinaker To: gentoo-dev@gentoo.org In-Reply-To: <20020408215909.03ad451d.thilo.bangert@gmx.net> References: <001901c1dd26$68a45360$2401a8c0@malachite.ath.cx> <20020408191800.87FCB20EEAE1@chiba.3jane.net> <1018294763.4266.8.camel@maas.wired> <20020408215909.03ad451d.thilo.bangert@gmx.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.0.3 Date: 08 Apr 2002 22:22:45 +0200 Message-Id: <1018297368.4266.28.camel@maas.wired> Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: gentoo-dev-admin@gentoo.org Errors-To: gentoo-dev-admin@gentoo.org X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@gentoo.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.6 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: gentoo-dev@gentoo.org List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Gentoo Linux developer list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: X-Archives-Salt: 9a45f7c1-d9dd-4bc2-bab6-1d54cc45bf94 X-Archives-Hash: 86830d164fe4e4f15d0040c62701e8bf On Mon, 2002-04-08 at 21:59, Thilo Bangert wrote: > > Hmmm... I've just experienced the joys of completely reinstalling a > > server while it was actually running. That is, I installed gentoo on > > it while I had the RedHat installation running - and just replaced > > the services from the RedHat system with those from the Gentoo > > chroot one by one until everything ran from the Gentoo installation. > > I then did a quick reboot and had a fully functional Gentoo > > replacement system running. Downtime was two minutes. > >=20 >=20 > great - i plan on doing this myself. > good to hear somebody already accomplished this... > (amazing downtime!) For a complete system reinstallation and reconfiguration including data transfers i would say 2 minutes is rather nice, yeah :D try doing that with redhat, debian or whatever (no flames, plz) > > I can also contribute with maybe a bootdisk/netinstall and even a > > more automated installation process for people not really knowing > > what they are doing - if there is any interest for it >=20 > i've said this before: i wouldn't want to make it too easy for=20 > people - thats what made gentoo really fun True. However, I think the installation process is unneccessarily complex, because you set up the gentoo environment manually, but all the boot-scripts etc which really teach you the inner workings of linux are automatically installed. Sure, newbies won't be afraid of recompiling their kernel etc, but it's not a "complete" learning experience. But I do know that the feeling most newbies have after installing it will most certainly motivate them to play around some more with the linux system (which is what you *should* do with linux; play around), and this is definitely a good thing. I know I was pretty damn proud after doing my first lfs install. Anyways, you've probably had discussions on this before, so I'll just leave it to the dev's. > yes, a steep learning curve will scare some people away, but it will > make tech support much more easy (in the long) > (perhaps this is all wrong, because then people just start > doing new stuff...) hehe, well, there's really nothing stopping me, or anyone else, from making a GentooEasyInstall(tm) disk/cd which does this, so I wouldn't have that as my primary business model ;) > also, gentoo is constantly under (more or less) heavy development > (getting better every day). brave newbies have no problem dealing > with that, but they can handle heavy documentation as well... >=20 > i don't want to kill your attempt on doing something good - i just > personally feel we should not lower the high standards (in terms > of dificulty or "heaviness") of the gentoo documentation Also true, I just thought it would get some pressure off of the mailing lists and make the gentoo install process a bit more flexible for people who don't have the skills/creativity to do stuff like this - but if they don't i guess they shouldn't be doing it in any case :) > a dedicated gentoo floppy bootdisc really sounds like a good idea Yup. I'll look into it, but no promises. --=20 Erik Grinaker Freelance UNIX/Linux systems consultant "Perfection is acheived not when there is nothing more to add, but rather when there is nothing more to take away" - Antoine de Saint-Exup=E9ry