Re: [gentoo-dev] Installer For Gentoo

["Brian Dwornick" <bdwor@comcast.net>]

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Patrick Lauer" <gentoo@toso-digitals.de>
> On Wed, 2004-01-14 at 22:09, Brian Dwornick wrote:
> > There are two very different reasons that I can see for making an
installer.
> > One is to make it easier to install gentoo for people that are not
> > comfortable with linux.  This in my opinion would be a bad move as
gentoo
> > isn't aimed to be the first linux distribution someone uses.
> I disagree. Teaching people something because it might be easier in the
> beginning is not always the best strategy.

I do agree that gentoo is good for people that want to learn.  Wanting to
learn and a pretty GUI are not on the same path.  I am more trying to make a
point that the people that would truely benifit from an installer are
sysadmins that are trying to mass load and do not want to resort to disk
imaging.  While a pretty GUI is good for a first time linux user, if they
really want to learn, they should use the install guide and go at it the old
fashoned way.

> <flame>
> Just look at all the people that need a mouse and a pretty icon to click
> at. How did they work with text-based editors a few years ago?
> Why can't the secretary that used DOS 3.3 to copy files use the Dos-box
> in Windows?
> </flame>
> I've observed that those people that are interested in learning (as
> opposed to those that want to get their work done) can benefit a lot
> from gentoo, and the others don't care (if there is a problem, _you_
> better fix it), so you can't loose (I hope)
>
> So, from my point of view, Gentoo is good since it teaches those that
> want to learn and makes life easier for me if I have to "repair" a
> broken system.
>
> >   The seconds
> > reason would be to make it easier to install in a corporate enviroment
> > (server farms, multiple offices, etc.)  With this in mind, I believe an
> > "installer" should be implemented as a text based script, not a pretty
GUI.
> I'm more for a config-file driven thingy with different frontends (nice
> GUI with text fallback or something like that), but someone has to
> implement it ...
>
> > It should read a config file made by whoever is doing the install that
has
> > many default configs in it and maybe prompt for the uses of the machine.
> > IE:
> If you could save / restore a config file you could easily clone a setup
> onto different hardware, and if you had automatic processor detection you
> could clone the setup _and_ optimise at the same time! :-)
>
> > The following configs have been detected please choose one:
> > [0] Prompt for config
> > [1] Desktop (KDE)
> > [2] Laptop (KDE)
> > [3] Email/Web/DNS Server (No X)
> > [4] Rendering Farm
> > ? 2
> Yes, that should be nice. Maybe a two- or three-layer menu, but
> nothing as horrible as dselect, please.
>
> > What stage would you like to start from?
> > [1]
> > [2]
> > [3]
> > ...
> > At this point the installer could make choices that would produce the
> > optimal system but without the system admin having to sit and type the
same
> > things over and over.  The make.conf could be generated by using /proc
and
> > the settings from the loaded config.
> You expect a lot of magic. I tend to dislike automatic detection of
hardware
> since it can never work on all available systems. But if it worked very
> well (99,999% ;-) ) it'd be really nice to have.
> Still, I'd like to have full manual control, e.g. disable automagic
> detection, force-load this module, ...
>
> > Basically, distributions like Redhat make many decisions for you.  I
would
> > hate to see an installer that took choices from the users hands, as,
gentoo
> > seems to be about choice.
> I agree.
>
> > My two cents,
> Euro or dollar?

which dollar?

>
> Patrick
>


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