From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org ([69.77.167.62] helo=lists.gentoo.org) by finch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1KLI07-0007fV-3g for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 13:33:59 +0000 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 20EA3E02E7; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 13:33:58 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp.gentoo.org (smtp.gentoo.org [140.211.166.183]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F0620E02E7 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 13:33:57 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [192.168.1.213] (unknown [74.92.132.138]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2609666F42; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 13:33:57 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: [gentoo-council] Extent of Code of Conduct enforcement From: Ferris McCormick To: gentoo-council Cc: Ferris McCormick In-Reply-To: <20080722063428.GB23164@aerie.halcy0n.com> References: <20080714063554.GB5982@comet> <20080722063428.GB23164@aerie.halcy0n.com> Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="=-BJWIM4liqkuBsVWtPI8b" Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2008 13:33:54 +0000 Message-Id: <1216733634.1979.159.camel@liasis.inforead.com> Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-council@lists.gentoo.org Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.12.3 X-Archives-Salt: 044f095a-ba2c-4f88-bc25-b9734cb17a82 X-Archives-Hash: 20458c81ce485544b97983379d942d6d --=-BJWIM4liqkuBsVWtPI8b Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Tue, 2008-07-22 at 02:34 -0400, Mark Loeser wrote: > Donnie Berkholz said: > > Can people be entirely banned from Gentoo? >=20 > It would be ideal, but not technically feasible. >=20 > > -=20 ....................... .......................................... >=20 > > - Why would we do it? >=20 > Because they are damaging the community and driving possible > contributors aways. >=20 Let me respond to this specifically. I have pretty strong views on this, and I suspect they might reflect a minority opinion. I'm going to divide this into two cases, because I think the first one is easy. First case is developers who leave or threaten to leave giving the reason that "XXX (a developer or user) drove them away because of ...". Second case is a sponsor who threatens to withdraw support "unless something is done about XXX." In the first case, my reaction is absolute. The developer who threatens to leave because of someone else is (1) making the judgment call that we care if he leaves; (2) Is resorting to extortion to get rid of someone else (or reign someone else in or whatever). At that point, I'd wish him well in his future endeavors and start retirement process. I view giving in to such a threat as at least as harmful as whatever or whoever triggered it in the first place. This is based on my own background and experiences, and others no doubt react differently. Now, there is a variation on this: The developer who resigns, citing abuse as the reason. Here, the process has broken down. Believe it or not, devrel and userrel will work with problems like this if we know there are such problems to address. For example, if you want me involved, best is to contact me personally or open a bug assigned to me. If you want someone else, do whatever that person prefers. It's a matter of posture --- we should all be prepared to help work out conflicts, but we should not give in to "He goes or I go."=20 The second case is more delicate. It is still a form of extortion, but conceivably with merit. I think the resolution requires negotiation with the sponsor and the "problem child". If we can reach no agreement, I suppose we have to do what seems best for the community. That will always be a decision depending on each circumstance. Probably nothing new here, but I wanted to clarify my opinion a bit. Regards, Ferris --=20 Ferris McCormick (P44646, MI) Developer, Gentoo Linux (Devrel, Sparc, Userrel, Trustees) --=-BJWIM4liqkuBsVWtPI8b Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.9 (GNU/Linux) iEYEABECAAYFAkiF4cIACgkQQa6M3+I///e9yQCePismTzbuf/dSI7//3fjuGpRr WoYAoJCUj927a76Zt0ygWpB5S8Ibbrsv =mb9y -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-BJWIM4liqkuBsVWtPI8b--