From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org ([69.77.167.62] helo=lists.gentoo.org) by finch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1JZnX8-0007Tj-UK for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Thu, 13 Mar 2008 13:31:47 +0000 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 2E396E084F; Thu, 13 Mar 2008 13:31:45 +0000 (UTC) Received: from ciao.gmane.org (main.gmane.org [80.91.229.2]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B33ABE084F for ; Thu, 13 Mar 2008 13:31:44 +0000 (UTC) Received: from list by ciao.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1JZnX0-0006Gp-FA for gentoo-amd64@lists.gentoo.org; Thu, 13 Mar 2008 13:31:38 +0000 Received: from ip68-231-12-179.ph.ph.cox.net ([68.231.12.179]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Thu, 13 Mar 2008 13:31:38 +0000 Received: from 1i5t5.duncan by ip68-231-12-179.ph.ph.cox.net with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Thu, 13 Mar 2008 13:31:38 +0000 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: gentoo-amd64@lists.gentoo.org From: Duncan <1i5t5.duncan@cox.net> Subject: [gentoo-amd64] Re: Obligatory KDE4 question. Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2008 13:31:32 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: References: <47D921FE.6030809@ercbroadband.org> Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-amd64@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-amd64@lists.gentoo.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: ip68-231-12-179.ph.ph.cox.net User-Agent: Pan/0.132 (Waxed in Black) Sender: news Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Archives-Salt: 8c072567-49b5-46c1-a707-e28386d90a16 X-Archives-Hash: 1329a9df039dc3e552b8dbaac45da4ac "Mark Haney" posted 47D921FE.6030809@ercbroadband.org, excerpted below, on Thu, 13 Mar 2008 08:45:50 -0400: > I swear I think I missed the threads on KDE4 after it was released. I'= m > sure by now at least some people are using it, so how is it on amd64? = I > know it's buggy and all that, but is it functional? Are there any > showstoppers you've seen? >=20 > I'd like to throw it on my dev box, but I'm not sure I want to spend a > lot of time mucking with compiling it if it's not at least somewhat > usable. Well... I've been compiling KDE-svn from the overlay for some months, but= =20 unfortunately hadn't really had any time to decently test it until this=20 last week. Because I was doing the SVN version, it was more crashy but=20 more featureful than the current 4.0.x release will ever be. Here, after actually getting a bit of time to test what I had been=20 compiling, I gave up. Due to lack of what I consider necessary features,= =20 it's simply not worth any more of my time until at /least/ pre-4.1.x=20 feature-freeze, and at this point, honestly, it could easily be pre-4.2.x= =20 feature-freeze. =20 Individual applications may have a bit of eye candy and be worth running,= =20 but the desktop as a whole isn't, at least not for "power users" like me=20 that tend to use the powerful customization and productivity elements of=20 the mature KDE-3.5 desktop such as multiple panels and personalized=20 hotkeys and colors. Huge swaths of GUI customization simply isn't there=20 or doesn't work as originally advertised that KDE-4 would work. True,=20 users that are as comfortable configuring text files as clicking a button= =20 or dragging a slider can already configure a lot of that stuff manually,=20 but what's the point of spending time in a GUI if you can't even=20 configure itself with itself? (That BTW is one of the points I've=20 brought up against GNOME any number of times, advanced GUI config can=20 only be done by editing text files, or worse yet for those of us who=20 still have MS nightmares from time to time, registry edits.) Granted, there's the bit of limited functionality there that GNOME style=20 users who prefer NOT to have advanced GUI config options to worry about=20 (either because they configure them manually or because they just accept=20 the defaults) should appreciate -- they may in fact /love/ it -- but for=20 those KDE-3 users who've grown to love its GUI tweakability, there's a=20 LONG way to go yet before KDE-4 gets even close, let alone has all the=20 fancy new KDE-4 features we were sold as worth the long wait. It may=20 indeed ultimately be worth the wait, I certainly hope and expect so, but=20 if so, that wait isn't over yet. So put simply, I recommend staying put with KDE 3.5.9, for now. There=20 will be time enough to try out KDE 4 after 4.1 comes out this (northern=20 hemisphere) summer, or 4.2, early next year I'd guess. Right now, the=20 rumors saying it's little more than a developer's preview and base on=20 which to build are all too true. As an example... remember all the talk about plasma and the ability it=20 was supposed to have to move apps seamlessly from floating to panel to=20 desktop and back again? Well, desktop to panel sort of works, but=20 there's no way to move stuff around in the panel at all without deleting=20 it and re-adding it, let alone back to the desktop, and there's no hint=20 of the formerly promised moving between a floating app and either the=20 desktop or panel. That, coupled with the fact that there's no way to=20 create additional panels, and on dual-head displays, the panel can=20 apparently move to any side -- of ONE head -- it can't move to another=20 head at all, means the desktop is essentially useless for me with my five= =20 separate panels each with separate functions and configuration on KDE-3. = =20 It was nice to be able to move applets from the panel to the desktop and=20 I tried using that as a bit of a workaround, but it's not the same, and=20 there then seems to be no way to remove the panel. Further, even just=20 being able to set the size of the panel at all is a feature brand new to=20 KDE-4.0.2, and not much older in SVN-trunk. As I said, there's a LONG way to go! No way could I recommend it at=20 present, except for those (like myself) that simply have to see for=20 themselves, and have the time and the energy to do so. It'll be nice=20 when it gets there, but it's not there yet. --=20 Duncan - List replies preferred. No HTML msgs. "Every nonfree program has a lord, a master -- and if you use the program, he is your master." Richard Stallman --=20 gentoo-amd64@lists.gentoo.org mailing list