From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D613E138CCF for ; Sat, 23 May 2015 11:37:35 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 9ACE6E0968; Sat, 23 May 2015 11:37:27 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-ie0-f181.google.com (mail-ie0-f181.google.com [209.85.223.181]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E747EE095D for ; Sat, 23 May 2015 11:37:26 +0000 (UTC) Received: by iebgx4 with SMTP id gx4so47349640ieb.0 for ; Sat, 23 May 2015 04:37:26 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject :from:to:content-type; bh=fiRwgTypOGq4Dxx0D1/ViS2+ahmkvqMInvLW6MF4i9M=; b=wH6zfEOaPpHy4/VGG3KRhWwpBdhy4hUdFEB209s1nnkr55p2HQrP9zF6URmooqi/Y5 5+gvvl9ORHbwhBpATa/s0t/0lB0pp2RM7gyvvVqf0XY/PfFcVuGiK49Ev8g7H/x3h+jK 1fmFmQ3uRNja+aA8/C4g3/7EpjTkmvuFpkq5kMS00WeggEBlBZiHGG1cThwQ1Tb+a+xN tBpFu3Tt1AynXQjzEmDwVNarWbGn2pkbvHgmadS60NTbLxHWB1eTsRG5PacjbV+2+M+E 4KSlF5soIPC+rDsSFhPZlqud1aBLqokaYwy6Cme9RjthFpLVim8YW2RsXPdC5io09DK+ MITQ== Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-amd64@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-amd64@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.107.9.223 with SMTP id 92mr5419697ioj.71.1432381046268; Sat, 23 May 2015 04:37:26 -0700 (PDT) Sender: freemanrich@gmail.com Received: by 10.107.159.81 with HTTP; Sat, 23 May 2015 04:37:26 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <20150523131156.01ba56fe@marcec> References: <20150224211545.50495cc0@marcec.fritz.box> <20150520100113.1c44169f@marcec> <20150523104907.7210565a@marcec> <20150523131156.01ba56fe@marcec> Date: Sat, 23 May 2015 07:37:26 -0400 X-Google-Sender-Auth: aFbykN0edLUVBUtQFrSNkw1eGlQ Message-ID: Subject: Re: [gentoo-amd64] Re: Systemd migration: opinion and questions From: Rich Freeman To: gentoo-amd64@lists.gentoo.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 X-Archives-Salt: 148e2660-5f03-41c6-9628-31b25042dc72 X-Archives-Hash: 76696748425bccbbecda4ff130a063f4 On Sat, May 23, 2015 at 7:11 AM, Marc Joliet wrote: > [snip empty @system approach] > > Wow, that's certainly an interesting approach! It's definitely not for me, > though. While I appreciate the control Gentoo gives me, I don't need *that* > kind of control. > I'd actually like to see Gentoo evolve until we reach a point where this sort of thing is easy to do safely. Right now @system is a mish-mash of a bunch of stuff and it is hard to pick out stuff like openssh which is trivially removable from stuff like openrc which has surprising reverse deps from stuff like glibc which obviously isn't going anywhere anytime soon. I'd really like to see a few virtuals created (perhaps nesting) that chop this up into categories like recommend-default packages, stuff required for POSIX, and so on. We can still give users a good default experience, and we can still avoid having ebuilds having to list out a laundry-list of deps, but we can also do things like allow more parallel-building and make it easier to remove stuff. -- Rich