[gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Mark Knecht]

Hi all,
   I've never used VMware but someone suggested I try their VMware
Player app. Looking around I ran across info on the workstation
version here:

http://gentoo-wiki.com/HOWTO_setup_VMware

but nothing yet on the Player app. Is anyone using the Player? Does
any of this work on the 64-bit platform or do I need to run all of
this chroot'ed?

   Since VMware is a retail app I assume all the WIKI is showing is
how to get the workstation set up and that I'd have to have a license
to actually use it? Or is this not the case? I didn't spot any
comments about entering license numbers, etc., and never having used
VMware I wouldn't really know what to look for anyway.

Thanks in advance,
Mark

-- 
gentoo-amd64@gentoo.org mailing list

Re: [gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Thierry de Coulon]

On Wednesday 08 March 2006 02.06, Mark Knecht wrote:
> Hi all,
>    I've never used VMware but someone suggested I try their VMware
> Player app. Looking around I ran across info on the workstation
> version here:
>
> http://gentoo-wiki.com/HOWTO_setup_VMware
>
> but nothing yet on the Player app. Is anyone using the Player? Does
> any of this work on the 64-bit platform or do I need to run all of
> this chroot'ed?

Yes, I've used the vmware-player. If I remember well, the player is masked 
(amd64 keyword), but not vmware-workstation.

It did work , but apparently shared folders are deactivated in the player at 
the time. So I ended up upgrading vmware-workstation and that's what I am 
using now.

>    Since VMware is a retail app I assume all the WIKI is showing is
> how to get the workstation set up and that I'd have to have a license
> to actually use it? Or is this not the case? I didn't spot any
> comments about entering license numbers, etc., and never having used
> VMware I wouldn't really know what to look for anyway.

No, you don't need to pay to use vmware.player. The catch is that the player 
has some limitations, the most important being that you can't create a 
virtual machine - so you have to create it on another machine running 
workstation, or download one somewhere.

I also noticed that I got regular errors when starting the player, but could 
start it in the end, while the problem did not occur with workstation.

The bottom line (I think) is that if you rellly need en emulator like vmware, 
you should think about getting workstation. If it's more a matter of trying, 
you won't break much with player. Note that player is easily removed the day 
you want to emerge workstatiion.

> Thanks in advance,
> Mark

Have a nice day

Thierry

-- 
The problem with the world is stupidity. Not saying there should be a
capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the
safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?
Frank Zappa
-- 
gentoo-amd64@gentoo.org mailing list

Re: [gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Richard Freeman]

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Thierry de Coulon wrote:
> The bottom line (I think) is that if you rellly need en emulator like vmware, 
> you should think about getting workstation. If it's more a matter of trying, 
> you won't break much with player. Note that player is easily removed the day 
> you want to emerge workstatiion.
> 


Note that VMWare now has a server version which is also free.  The
featureset is not the same as workstation, but is a subset of their
server line of products (I suppose with the goal of encouraging
migrations into that line of products).  I think it might still be in
beta - there are no ebuilds for it yet.
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Re: [gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Mark Knecht]

Thierry,
   Thanks for the response. I tried the player. It emerged but didn't
run complaining that I hadn't configured it. With no good instructions
about to get me through that quickly I've put the idea to bed for now.
I'll revisit it later if it makes sense.

Thanks much,
Mark

On 3/7/06, Thierry de Coulon <tcoulon@decoulon.ch> wrote:
> On Wednesday 08 March 2006 02.06, Mark Knecht wrote:
> > Hi all,
> >    I've never used VMware but someone suggested I try their VMware
> > Player app. Looking around I ran across info on the workstation
> > version here:
> >
> > http://gentoo-wiki.com/HOWTO_setup_VMware
> >
> > but nothing yet on the Player app. Is anyone using the Player? Does
> > any of this work on the 64-bit platform or do I need to run all of
> > this chroot'ed?
>
> Yes, I've used the vmware-player. If I remember well, the player is masked
> (amd64 keyword), but not vmware-workstation.
>
> It did work , but apparently shared folders are deactivated in the player at
> the time. So I ended up upgrading vmware-workstation and that's what I am
> using now.
>
> >    Since VMware is a retail app I assume all the WIKI is showing is
> > how to get the workstation set up and that I'd have to have a license
> > to actually use it? Or is this not the case? I didn't spot any
> > comments about entering license numbers, etc., and never having used
> > VMware I wouldn't really know what to look for anyway.
>
> No, you don't need to pay to use vmware.player. The catch is that the player
> has some limitations, the most important being that you can't create a
> virtual machine - so you have to create it on another machine running
> workstation, or download one somewhere.
>
> I also noticed that I got regular errors when starting the player, but could
> start it in the end, while the problem did not occur with workstation.
>
> The bottom line (I think) is that if you rellly need en emulator like vmware,
> you should think about getting workstation. If it's more a matter of trying,
> you won't break much with player. Note that player is easily removed the day
> you want to emerge workstatiion.
>
> > Thanks in advance,
> > Mark
>
> Have a nice day
>
> Thierry
>
> --
> The problem with the world is stupidity. Not saying there should be a
> capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the
> safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?
> Frank Zappa
> --
> gentoo-amd64@gentoo.org mailing list
>
>

-- 
gentoo-amd64@gentoo.org mailing list

Re: [gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Thierry de Coulon]

On Thursday 09 March 2006 03.45, Mark Knecht wrote:
> Thierry,
>    Thanks for the response. I tried the player. It emerged but didn't
> run complaining that I hadn't configured it. With no good instructions
> about to get me through that quickly I've put the idea to bed for now.
> I'll revisit it later if it makes sense.
>
> Thanks much,
> Mark

I just came accross an article takling about a new program names 
"parallels" (www.parallels.com) that is supposed to do the same thing as 
vmware while being less expensive.

No ideas as to ebuilds but I'll give it a look - it should be able to run OS/2 
and I'd like to see that.

Thierry

-- 
The problem with the world is stupidity. Not saying there should be a
capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the
safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?
Frank Zappa
-- 
gentoo-amd64@gentoo.org mailing list

Re: [gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Mark Knecht]

On 3/9/06, Thierry de Coulon <tcoulon@decoulon.ch> wrote:
> On Thursday 09 March 2006 03.45, Mark Knecht wrote:
> > Thierry,
> >    Thanks for the response. I tried the player. It emerged but didn't
> > run complaining that I hadn't configured it. With no good instructions
> > about to get me through that quickly I've put the idea to bed for now.
> > I'll revisit it later if it makes sense.
> >
> > Thanks much,
> > Mark
>
> I just came accross an article takling about a new program names
> "parallels" (www.parallels.com) that is supposed to do the same thing as
> vmware while being less expensive.
>
> No ideas as to ebuilds but I'll give it a look - it should be able to run OS/2
> and I'd like to see that.
>
> Thierry
>

Very interesting! For $49 it might be worth a try.

Their downloads page for the trial version references a 'Gentoo
ebuilds archive'. That's a good sign. (I think...) ;-)

Thanks!

- Mark

-- 
gentoo-amd64@gentoo.org mailing list

Re: [gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Thierry de Coulon]

On Thursday 09 March 2006 15.30, Mark Knecht wrote:
> On 3/9/06, Thierry de Coulon <tcoulon@decoulon.ch> wrote:
> > On Thursday 09 March 2006 03.45, Mark Knecht wrote:
> > > Thierry,
> > >    Thanks for the response. I tried the player. It emerged but didn't
> > > run complaining that I hadn't configured it. With no good instructions
> > > about to get me through that quickly I've put the idea to bed for now.
> > > I'll revisit it later if it makes sense.
> > >
> > > Thanks much,
> > > Mark
> >
> > I just came accross an article takling about a new program names
> > "parallels" (www.parallels.com) that is supposed to do the same thing as
> > vmware while being less expensive.
> >
> > No ideas as to ebuilds but I'll give it a look - it should be able to run
> > OS/2 and I'd like to see that.
> >
> > Thierry
>
> Very interesting! For $49 it might be worth a try.
>
> Their downloads page for the trial version references a 'Gentoo
> ebuilds archive'. That's a good sign. (I think...) ;-)
>
> Thanks!
>
> - Mark

Well, I've tested it and now have my good old OS/2 back working, including nfs 
network!
But I have that on my notebook - because Parallels doesn't configure on a 64 
bit machine at the time.
I also got news of a new Win4lin Pro version (Win4Lin uses qemu), and they are 
promoting their software.

Also not that while some sell every release (vmware and, it seems, parallels 
have you pay every *.x release - Win4lin users have acces to every release 
since 1.0, maybe because it never workes properly ;)

Well, the fact that their machine runs OS/2 geot parallels my money... brings 
back a lot of feelings :)

Thierry

-- 
The problem with the world is stupidity. Not saying there should be a
capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the
safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?
Frank Zappa
-- 
gentoo-amd64@gentoo.org mailing list

Re: [gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Mark Knecht]

Hi Thierry,
   It's good news that Parallels worked that well for you that
quickly. Was it pretty straight forward to bring up?

   Any thoughts on whether it would be likely to work in a chroot'ed
32-bit environment on my 64-bit Gentoo machine?

Cheers,
Mark

On 3/10/06, Thierry de Coulon <tcoulon@decoulon.ch> wrote:
> On Thursday 09 March 2006 15.30, Mark Knecht wrote:
> > On 3/9/06, Thierry de Coulon <tcoulon@decoulon.ch> wrote:
> > > On Thursday 09 March 2006 03.45, Mark Knecht wrote:
> > > > Thierry,
> > > >    Thanks for the response. I tried the player. It emerged but didn't
> > > > run complaining that I hadn't configured it. With no good instructions
> > > > about to get me through that quickly I've put the idea to bed for now.
> > > > I'll revisit it later if it makes sense.
> > > >
> > > > Thanks much,
> > > > Mark
> > >
> > > I just came accross an article takling about a new program names
> > > "parallels" (www.parallels.com) that is supposed to do the same thing as
> > > vmware while being less expensive.
> > >
> > > No ideas as to ebuilds but I'll give it a look - it should be able to run
> > > OS/2 and I'd like to see that.
> > >
> > > Thierry
> >
> > Very interesting! For $49 it might be worth a try.
> >
> > Their downloads page for the trial version references a 'Gentoo
> > ebuilds archive'. That's a good sign. (I think...) ;-)
> >
> > Thanks!
> >
> > - Mark
>
> Well, I've tested it and now have my good old OS/2 back working, including nfs
> network!
> But I have that on my notebook - because Parallels doesn't configure on a 64
> bit machine at the time.
> I also got news of a new Win4lin Pro version (Win4Lin uses qemu), and they are
> promoting their software.
>
> Also not that while some sell every release (vmware and, it seems, parallels
> have you pay every *.x release - Win4lin users have acces to every release
> since 1.0, maybe because it never workes properly ;)
>
> Well, the fact that their machine runs OS/2 geot parallels my money... brings
> back a lot of feelings :)
>
> Thierry
>
> --
> The problem with the world is stupidity. Not saying there should be a
> capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the
> safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?
> Frank Zappa
> --
> gentoo-amd64@gentoo.org mailing list
>
>

-- 
gentoo-amd64@gentoo.org mailing list

Re: [gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Thierry de Coulon]

On Saturday 11 March 2006 16.30, Mark Knecht wrote:
> Hi Thierry,
>    It's good news that Parallels worked that well for you that
> quickly. Was it pretty straight forward to bring up?
>
>    Any thoughts on whether it would be likely to work in a chroot'ed
> 32-bit environment on my 64-bit Gentoo machine?
>
> Cheers,
> Mark

Hi Mark,

As it won't work on my Gentoo amd64 I made the test on a SuSE (I have not 
converted to Gentoo on the laptop yet because I could not get hibernation to 
work correctly). It was as easy as: install rpm with Yast, run the config 
script, install a virtual machine.

I have no experience with chroot'ed environments (except for the one I used 
while setting up Gentoo), so I can't answer your question.

The ebuild emerges correctly, the problem is when you run the configure script 
that should compile the module - so I'd guess this is a problem relatd to the 
fact that /lib does not point to 32 bit libraries.

As far as a chroot'ed environments supplies the right libraries it should 
work.

Thierry
-- 
The problem with the world is stupidity. Not saying there should be a
capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the
safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?
Frank Zappa
-- 
gentoo-amd64@gentoo.org mailing list

Re: [gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Mark Knecht]

Thanks Thierry,
   I'm looking at what to download right now. Did you use the 2.0
release or the 2.1RC?

   If it works I'll be doing a Win XP install within a chroot already
on the machine. We'll see...

Thanks,
Mark

On 3/11/06, Thierry de Coulon <tcoulon@decoulon.ch> wrote:
> On Saturday 11 March 2006 16.30, Mark Knecht wrote:
> > Hi Thierry,
> >    It's good news that Parallels worked that well for you that
> > quickly. Was it pretty straight forward to bring up?
> >
> >    Any thoughts on whether it would be likely to work in a chroot'ed
> > 32-bit environment on my 64-bit Gentoo machine?
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Mark
>
> Hi Mark,
>
> As it won't work on my Gentoo amd64 I made the test on a SuSE (I have not
> converted to Gentoo on the laptop yet because I could not get hibernation to
> work correctly). It was as easy as: install rpm with Yast, run the config
> script, install a virtual machine.
>
> I have no experience with chroot'ed environments (except for the one I used
> while setting up Gentoo), so I can't answer your question.
>
> The ebuild emerges correctly, the problem is when you run the configure script
> that should compile the module - so I'd guess this is a problem relatd to the
> fact that /lib does not point to 32 bit libraries.
>
> As far as a chroot'ed environments supplies the right libraries it should
> work.
>
> Thierry
> --
> The problem with the world is stupidity. Not saying there should be a
> capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the
> safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?
> Frank Zappa
> --
> gentoo-amd64@gentoo.org mailing list
>
>

-- 
gentoo-amd64@gentoo.org mailing list

Re: [gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Thierry de Coulon]

On Saturday 11 March 2006 17.58, Mark Knecht wrote:
> Thanks Thierry,
>    I'm looking at what to download right now. Did you use the 2.0
> release or the 2.1RC?
>
>    If it works I'll be doing a Win XP install within a chroot already
> on the machine. We'll see...
>
> Thanks,
> Mark

The trial download proposed 2.1 Beta 2 and that's what I used. If you 
purchase, you get a 2.0 key (that does not work on 2.1!) but you should get 
the good key soon when they release 2.1

So I'd test 2.1, as it seems stable - I've got OS72 working with nfs in very 
little time.
The only thing I could not get to work is the (real) cd rom. Parallels say 
someting about needing rights on the cdrom (chmod a+r) but it does not seem 
to work, anything I try I can only mount an iso file.

However, given nfs access, it's not a problem, even more as os/2 is installed 
mostly because I have a lot of old files requiring os/2 programs and because 
I was ready to spend $50 to get old feelings back :)

On gentoo I can use vmware on the rare cases where I have to fire up Windows.

Thierry


-- 
The problem with the world is stupidity. Not saying there should be a
capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the
safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?
Frank Zappa
-- 
gentoo-amd64@gentoo.org mailing list

Re: [gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Mark Knecht]

On 3/11/06, Thierry de Coulon <tcoulon@decoulon.ch> wrote:
> On Saturday 11 March 2006 17.58, Mark Knecht wrote:
> > Thanks Thierry,
> >    I'm looking at what to download right now. Did you use the 2.0
> > release or the 2.1RC?
> >
> >    If it works I'll be doing a Win XP install within a chroot already
> > on the machine. We'll see...
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Mark
>
> The trial download proposed 2.1 Beta 2 and that's what I used. If you
> purchase, you get a 2.0 key (that does not work on 2.1!) but you should get
> the good key soon when they release 2.1
>
> So I'd test 2.1, as it seems stable - I've got OS72 working with nfs in very
> little time.
> The only thing I could not get to work is the (real) cd rom. Parallels say
> someting about needing rights on the cdrom (chmod a+r) but it does not seem
> to work, anything I try I can only mount an iso file.
>
> However, given nfs access, it's not a problem, even more as os/2 is installed
> mostly because I have a lot of old files requiring os/2 programs and because
> I was ready to spend $50 to get old feelings back :)
>
> On gentoo I can use vmware on the rare cases where I have to fire up Windows.
>
> Thierry

Hi Thierrry,
   Strange that the download I ended up with (using the emerge
installation files they provide)
seems to be 2.0. None the less the emerge inside of my chroot went
cleanly. I then ran the Parallels-config step and see this message:

     Configuring Parallels Workstation 2.0 drivers...
     Compiling Parallels Workstation 2.0 drivers...
     Drivers have been compiled successfully.
     Installing drivers...
     Starting drivers...
Load Parallels Workstation 2.0 hypervisor ...
insmod: error inserting
'/usr/lib/Parallels/Drivers/Hypervisor/hypervisor.o': -1 Invalid
module format
 Can not load hypervisor module.
Configuration completed successfully

Now you can run Parallels Workstation 2.0
    Issue "Parallels" command.

lightning portage #

Did you see anything like this?

1) Does it matter?
2) Is it possibly because of my chroot?

I'll comtinue on and see how it goes.

Cheers,
Mark

-- 
gentoo-amd64@gentoo.org mailing list

Re: [gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Mark Knecht]

Answering self:

On 3/11/06, Mark Knecht <markknecht@gmail.com> wrote:

> 1) Does it matter?

Yes.

> 2) Is it possibly because of my chroot?

Most probably yes.

>
> I'll comtinue on and see how it goes.
>

When you are running do you see new modules loaded? When I try to run
insode the chroot I end up with this message:

lightning portage # Parallels
Module vm-main is not found! Parallels Workstation 2.0 is installed,
but it has not been configured for your running kernel. To configure
it please login as root and run Parallels-config. For more information
see the INSTALL file in Parallels Workstation 2.0 documentation
directory.
lightning portage #

Almost certainy this is beacuse of being the the chroot jail and not
being able to load the module in the 64-bit environment I suppose.

Ho humm......

- Mark

-- 
gentoo-amd64@gentoo.org mailing list

Re: [gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Thierry de Coulon]

On Saturday 11 March 2006 19.57, Mark Knecht wrote:
> Answering self:
>
> On 3/11/06, Mark Knecht <markknecht@gmail.com> wrote:
> > 1) Does it matter?
>
> Yes.
>
> > 2) Is it possibly because of my chroot?
>
> Most probably yes.
>
> > I'll comtinue on and see how it goes.
>
> When you are running do you see new modules loaded? When I try to run
> insode the chroot I end up with this message:
>
> lightning portage # Parallels
> Module vm-main is not found! Parallels Workstation 2.0 is installed,
> but it has not been configured for your running kernel. To configure
> it please login as root and run Parallels-config. For more information
> see the INSTALL file in Parallels Workstation 2.0 documentation
> directory.
> lightning portage #
>
> Almost certainy this is beacuse of being the the chroot jail and not
> being able to load the module in the 64-bit environment I suppose.
>
> Ho humm......
>
> - Mark

I'd say you are right.
I would suggest you send a message to parallels support. I did that to make 
sure about the license number and got a very fast answer.

This would confirm your hypothesis and make them aware there may be a market 
for a 64 bit version...

Thierry

-- 
The problem with the world is stupidity. Not saying there should be a
capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the
safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?
Frank Zappa
-- 
gentoo-amd64@gentoo.org mailing list

Re: [gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Mark Knecht]

On 3/11/06, Thierry de Coulon <tcoulon@decoulon.ch> wrote:
> On Saturday 11 March 2006 19.57, Mark Knecht wrote:
> > Answering self:
> >
> > On 3/11/06, Mark Knecht <markknecht@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > 1) Does it matter?
> >
> > Yes.
> >
> > > 2) Is it possibly because of my chroot?
> >
> > Most probably yes.
> >
> > > I'll comtinue on and see how it goes.
> >
> > When you are running do you see new modules loaded? When I try to run
> > insode the chroot I end up with this message:
> >
> > lightning portage # Parallels
> > Module vm-main is not found! Parallels Workstation 2.0 is installed,
> > but it has not been configured for your running kernel. To configure
> > it please login as root and run Parallels-config. For more information
> > see the INSTALL file in Parallels Workstation 2.0 documentation
> > directory.
> > lightning portage #
> >
> > Almost certainy this is beacuse of being the the chroot jail and not
> > being able to load the module in the 64-bit environment I suppose.
> >
> > Ho humm......
> >
> > - Mark
>
> I'd say you are right.
> I would suggest you send a message to parallels support. I did that to make
> sure about the license number and got a very fast answer.
>
> This would confirm your hypothesis and make them aware there may be a market
> for a 64 bit version...
>
> Thierry
>

Done. Thanks for the help. I'll report back when they answer. Most
likely there is just no support, or maybe even some technical reason
why we cannot run a 64-bit Linux install along side of a 32-bit
Windows install. I've asked for some info on that. We'll see.

QUESTION: Should I not (somehow) be able to boot my chrooted 32-bit
environment instead of 64-bit as a grub option? I've not tried to do
that on this machine. It's always run 64-bit from day 1.

Cheers,
Mark

-- 
gentoo-amd64@gentoo.org mailing list

[gentoo-amd64] Re: VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Duncan]

Mark Knecht posted
<5bdc1c8b0603111127l3caf70f8q754e5d4b8ddefd97@mail.gmail.com>, excerpted
below,  on Sat, 11 Mar 2006 11:27:50 -0800:

> QUESTION: Should I not (somehow) be able to boot my chrooted 32-bit
> environment instead of 64-bit as a grub option? I've not tried to do
> that on this machine. It's always run 64-bit from day 1.

Yes, you should, provided you have built an entire 32-bit system, kernel
and all included.  The 32-bit system will need to be on its own partition
as well, I believe, or at least that would be simplest.

You /should/ be able to boot a 64-bit kernel with a 32-bit userland, as
well, given of course that you've opted for 32-bit executable support,
which I assume you have if you are running a 32-bit chroot.  Just point
root at your 32-bit root partition, but load a 64-bit kernel.

As for the parallels problem...  It's apparently trying to install a
32-bit module (binary-only slaveryware I assume) in a 64-bit kernel. 
That's not going to work for the same reason 32-bit libraries won't work
in 64-bit executables.  You'll need a 32-bit kernel, the first option
above.  Of course, that means you won't be able to do 64-bit at all until
you reboot to 64-bit.

-- 
Duncan - List replies preferred.   No HTML msgs.
"Every nonfree program has a lord, a master --
and if you use the program, he is your master."  Richard Stallman in
http://www.linuxdevcenter.com/pub/a/linux/2004/12/22/rms_interview.html


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Re: [gentoo-amd64] Re: VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Mark Knecht]

On 3/11/06, Duncan <1i5t5.duncan@cox.net> wrote:
> Mark Knecht posted
> <5bdc1c8b0603111127l3caf70f8q754e5d4b8ddefd97@mail.gmail.com>, excerpted
> below,  on Sat, 11 Mar 2006 11:27:50 -0800:
>
> > QUESTION: Should I not (somehow) be able to boot my chrooted 32-bit
> > environment instead of 64-bit as a grub option? I've not tried to do
> > that on this machine. It's always run 64-bit from day 1.
>
> Yes, you should, provided you have built an entire 32-bit system, kernel
> and all included.  The 32-bit system will need to be on its own partition
> as well, I believe, or at least that would be simplest.
>
> You /should/ be able to boot a 64-bit kernel with a 32-bit userland, as
> well, given of course that you've opted for 32-bit executable support,
> which I assume you have if you are running a 32-bit chroot.  Just point
> root at your 32-bit root partition, but load a 64-bit kernel.
>
> As for the parallels problem...  It's apparently trying to install a
> 32-bit module (binary-only slaveryware I assume) in a 64-bit kernel.
> That's not going to work for the same reason 32-bit libraries won't work
> in 64-bit executables.  You'll need a 32-bit kernel, the first option
> above.  Of course, that means you won't be able to do 64-bit at all until
> you reboot to 64-bit.

OK, so I took a minute, double checked the fstab inside the 32-bit
system, made a few changes, and then set up a specific boot option in
grub to be able to do this. It worked, but booted a 64-bit kernel. My
problem right now is that the 32-bit area is trying to build a 64-bit
kernel. Here are the two /etc/make.conf files:

lightning ~ # cat /etc/make.conf
# These settings were set by the catalyst build script that
automatically built this stage
CFLAGS="-march=k8 -O2 -pipe"
CHOST="x86_64-pc-linux-gnu"
USE="radeon mmx mmxext sse sse2 3dnow 3dnowext gnome kde -arts ladspa
nptl nptlo nly audiofile gimp gimpprint ppds usb alsa cdr dvd dvdr
dvdread jack jack-tmpfs fluidsynth tcltk sndfile v4l v4l2 mysql flac
xscreensaver -samba i8x0 mythtv apa che2 lirc mjpeg xvid real"
CXXFLAGS="${CFLAGS}"
MAKEOPTS="-j2"
GENTOO_MIRRORS="http://mirror.tucdemonic.org/gentoo/
ftp://ftp.gtlib.cc.gatech.e du/pub/gentoo http://mirror.gentoo.gr.jp
http://www.zentek-international.com/mir rors/gentoo/"
ACCEPT_KEYWORDS="amd64"
ALSA_CARDS="hdsp9652"
VIDEO_CARDS="radeon"
PORTDIR_OVERLAY=/usr/local/portage
lightning ~ # cat /mnt/gentoo32/etc/make.conf
# These settings were set by the catalyst build script that
automatically built this stage
# Please consult /etc/make.conf.example for a more detailed example
CFLAGS="-O2 -march=athlon-xp -msse2 -pipe -fomit-frame-pointer"
CHOST="i686-pc-linux-gnu"
CXXFLAGS="${CFLAGS}"
MAKEOPTS="-j2"
PORTDIR_OVERLAY=/usr/local/portage
lightning ~ #

What would I need to do to get the 32-bit area to build a 32-bit
kernel? When I run make menuconfig and try to change the processor I'm
only given 2 64-bit options.

thanks,
Mark

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Re: [gentoo-amd64] Re: VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Antoine Martin]

> What would I need to do to get the 32-bit area to build a 32-bit
> kernel? When I run make menuconfig and try to change the processor I'm
> only given 2 64-bit options.
Have you tried:
make ARCH=i386 menuconfig
make ARCH=i386

Antoine

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[gentoo-amd64] Re: Re: VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Duncan]

Antoine Martin posted <1142129346.11048.1.camel@localhost>, excerpted
below,  on Sun, 12 Mar 2006 02:09:06 +0000:

>> What would I need to do to get the 32-bit area to build a 32-bit
>> kernel? When I run make menuconfig and try to change the processor I'm
>> only given 2 64-bit options.
> Have you tried:
> make ARCH=i386 menuconfig
> make ARCH=i386

This was news to me -- I hadn't tried that.

What I would have done if I were creating a 32-bit chroot I intended to
boot, would be start from a 32-bit liveCD and do the entire Gentoo install
as if I were on a 32-bit machine installing Gentoo in its own partitions
along with some other OS -- that the other OS was Gentoo for amd64
wouldn't matter, as the two would be entirely separate installs -- only
from the 64-bit install some of the 32-bit could be mounted as a 32-bit
chroot.

I had always wondered how one got a 32-bit kernel config from a 64-bit
system, without starting from a 32-bit system already.  Assuming this is
correct, very cool, my wondering answered! =8^)

-- 
Duncan - List replies preferred.   No HTML msgs.
"Every nonfree program has a lord, a master --
and if you use the program, he is your master."  Richard Stallman in
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Re: [gentoo-amd64] Re: VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Mark Knecht]

On 3/11/06, Antoine Martin <antoine@nagafix.co.uk> wrote:
> > What would I need to do to get the 32-bit area to build a 32-bit
> > kernel? When I run make menuconfig and try to change the processor I'm
> > only given 2 64-bit options.
> Have you tried:
> make ARCH=i386 menuconfig
> make ARCH=i386
>
> Antoine

Forward progress. Thanks!

Is the second make ARCH-i386 required or was that offered as an
alternative? I did only the first and I now have all the processor
choices I wanted. My first kernel didn't boot correctly so I have to
debug that but that's pretty easy I'm sure.

Thanks,
Mark

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Re: [gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Mark Knecht]

On 3/11/06, Mark Knecht <markknecht@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 3/11/06, Thierry de Coulon <tcoulon@decoulon.ch> wrote:
> > On Saturday 11 March 2006 19.57, Mark Knecht wrote:
> > > Answering self:
> > >
> > > On 3/11/06, Mark Knecht <markknecht@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > 1) Does it matter?
> > >
> > > Yes.
> > >
> > > > 2) Is it possibly because of my chroot?
> > >
> > > Most probably yes.
> > >
> > > > I'll comtinue on and see how it goes.
> > >
> > > When you are running do you see new modules loaded? When I try to run
> > > insode the chroot I end up with this message:
> > >
> > > lightning portage # Parallels
> > > Module vm-main is not found! Parallels Workstation 2.0 is installed,
> > > but it has not been configured for your running kernel. To configure
> > > it please login as root and run Parallels-config. For more information
> > > see the INSTALL file in Parallels Workstation 2.0 documentation
> > > directory.
> > > lightning portage #
> > >
> > > Almost certainy this is beacuse of being the the chroot jail and not
> > > being able to load the module in the 64-bit environment I suppose.
> > >
> > > Ho humm......
> > >
> > > - Mark
> >
> > I'd say you are right.
> > I would suggest you send a message to parallels support. I did that to make
> > sure about the license number and got a very fast answer.
> >
> > This would confirm your hypothesis and make them aware there may be a market
> > for a 64 bit version...
> >
> > Thierry
> >
>
> Done. Thanks for the help. I'll report back when they answer. Most
> likely there is just no support, or maybe even some technical reason
> why we cannot run a 64-bit Linux install along side of a 32-bit
> Windows install. I've asked for some info on that. We'll see.
>
> QUESTION: Should I not (somehow) be able to boot my chrooted 32-bit
> environment instead of 64-bit as a grub option? I've not tried to do
> that on this machine. It's always run 64-bit from day 1.
>
> Cheers,
> Mark
>

As expected Parallels responded back this morning that they have no
support for 64-bit machines at this time. Their schedule is second
half 2006 so that could be 3 months or it could be 9 months. We'll
see...

Thanks for the help so far.

Cheers,
Mark

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Re: [gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Marco Matthies]

Thierry de Coulon wrote:
> I just came accross an article takling about a new program names 
> "parallels" (www.parallels.com) that is supposed to do the same thing as 
> vmware while being less expensive.

You might also want to check out qemu[1], which is free and is in 
portage -- the main difference is a somewhat more spartanic user interface.

Just remember to use the kernel module kqemu as well for adequate speed 
(somewhat less than vmware at the moment, but it is going to get to 
vmware levels pretty soon).

[1] http://fabrice.bellard.free.fr/qemu/

Marco
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Re: [gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Thierry de Coulon]

On Thursday 09 March 2006 17.22, Marco Matthies wrote:

> You might also want to check out qemu[1], which is free and is in
> portage -- the main difference is a somewhat more spartanic user interface.
>
> Just remember to use the kernel module kqemu as well for adequate speed
> (somewhat less than vmware at the moment, but it is going to get to
> vmware levels pretty soon).

I haven't tried qemu on Gentoo yet - my previous testing (with or without 
kernel module) showed a dramatic lack of speed (at least when powering a 
virtual machine running Windows).

I'm a supporter of open source, but there *are* closed source programs that 
perform better sometime (note that there also are closed source programs that 
perform worse...)

But I'll keep an eye on quemu - that by the way I believe is free but not 
really open source, but maybe I'm mistaking.

Thierry

-- 
The problem with the world is stupidity. Not saying there should be a
capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the
safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?
Frank Zappa
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Re: [gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Marco Matthies]

Thierry de Coulon wrote:
> I haven't tried qemu on Gentoo yet - my previous testing (with or without 
> kernel module) showed a dramatic lack of speed (at least when powering a 
> virtual machine running Windows).

Current cvs / the next qemu version will allow more to be virtualized 
(and therefore require less emulation), and people are reporting speeds 
in the same ballpark as vmware -- though I haven't tried the additional 
virtualization myself yet.  See [1] and the rest of the thread.

> I'm a supporter of open source, but there *are* closed source programs that 
> perform better sometime (note that there also are closed source programs that 
> perform worse...)

VMware is most certainly a very good and polished product and faster 
than qemu at the moment, I agree with you 100% there.  Mentioning qemu 
was just an idea for people who didn't want to spend any money :)

Also qemu has some interesting extra features, though these will 
probably be of lesser interest to people who only wish to run windows.

> But I'll keep an eye on quemu - that by the way I believe is free but not 
> really open source, but maybe I'm mistaking.

Qemu itself is LGPL, the kernel module is proprietary (but gratis). 
There is a GPL'd kernel module (qvm86[2]) that does the same job and 
hopefully this situation will improve in the future (i.e. both 
maintainers working on a GPL'd kernel module).

Marco

[1] http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/qemu-devel/2006-02/msg00110.html
[2] http://savannah.nongnu.org/projects/qvm86/
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Re: [gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Mark Knecht]

On 3/9/06, Marco Matthies <marco-ml@gmx.net> wrote:
> Thierry de Coulon wrote:
> > I just came accross an article takling about a new program names
> > "parallels" (www.parallels.com) that is supposed to do the same thing as
> > vmware while being less expensive.
>
> You might also want to check out qemu[1], which is free and is in
> portage -- the main difference is a somewhat more spartanic user interface.

Interesting, but I wonder whether a guitar player / chip designer type
guy could set it up? Spartanic is not generally a good environment for
the likes of us.

>
> Just remember to use the kernel module kqemu as well for adequate speed
> (somewhat less than vmware at the moment, but it is going to get to
> vmware levels pretty soon).

The web page say this module is closed source. If that's the case then
why qemu vs. VMware vs. Parallels?

Thanks. It's very intersting. How does this compare to BOCHS?

Cheers,
Mark
>
> [1] http://fabrice.bellard.free.fr/qemu/
>
> Marco
> --
> gentoo-amd64@gentoo.org mailing list
>
>

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Re: [gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Nuitari]

> The web page say this module is closed source. If that's the case then
> why qemu vs. VMware vs. Parallels?
>
> Thanks. It's very intersting. How does this compare to BOCHS?

Never could get Bochs to work
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Re: [gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Marco Matthies]

Mark Knecht wrote:
> Interesting, but I wonder whether a guitar player / chip designer type
> guy could set it up? Spartanic is not generally a good environment for
> the likes of us.

Qemu at the moment is a command-line app, with the graphical output in a 
window, though I believe to have heard of gui frontends but never 
actually used one.  VMWare has a graphical configuration and some extra 
convenience features that make it somewhat easier to use (e.g. bridged 
networking is a lot easier to set up and the VMware tools for windows 
have some nice extra features).  In time, these convenience features 
will probably be incorporated into qemu, too.  I don't know about 
Parallels, never tried it.

I would suggest trying out the trial versions of VMware and Parallels to 
see if you want to pay for them.  As to qemu, the qemu documentation [1] 
and user forums [2] will probably have some useful info.  There is also 
a nice repository of free os images that are ready to use [3].

> The web page say this module is closed source. If that's the case then
> why qemu vs. VMware vs. Parallels?

Well kqemu is gratis, and if you insist on free you can use qvm86, 
though that might be less tested.  As a kernel module can always take 
down your machine, i prefer the one a lot of people test -- i'm lazy :) 
  I don't know the history as to why kqemu is closed source (all of the 
author's other projects are open-source), but i'm hopeful that will change.

> Thanks. It's very intersting. How does this compare to BOCHS?

To my knowledge bochs is a lot slower than qemu even without kqemu. 
I've never tried it myself though as i've always been happy with qemu, 
so that might all be lies :)

Wikipedia has a nice page comparing emulation/virtualization/... 
solutions [4].

Marco

[1] http://fabrice.bellard.free.fr/qemu/user-doc.html
[2] http://qemu.dad-answers.com/
[3] http://free.oszoo.org/
[4] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_virtual_machines
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Re: [gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Paul de Vrieze]

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On Thursday 09 March 2006 03:45, Mark Knecht wrote:
> Thierry,
>    Thanks for the response. I tried the player. It emerged but didn't
> run complaining that I hadn't configured it. With no good instructions
> about to get me through that quickly I've put the idea to bed for now.
> I'll revisit it later if it makes sense.

You need to run a configure script. I don't know exactly where player stores 
it, but the ebuild should contain/output the information.

Paul

-- 
Paul de Vrieze
Gentoo Developer
Mail: pauldv@gentoo.org
Homepage: http://www.devrieze.net

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Re: [gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Nuitari]

> You need to run a configure script. I don't know exactly where player stores
> it, but the ebuild should contain/output the information.

They indicate it in the ebuild at the end when the install is done
/opt/vmware/bin/vmware-config.pl

Note that vmware-player and vmware-workstation are mutually exclusive
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Re: [gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Mark Knecht]

On 3/9/06, Nuitari <nuitari@melchior.nuitari.net> wrote:
> > You need to run a configure script. I don't know exactly where player stores
> > it, but the ebuild should contain/output the information.
>
> They indicate it in the ebuild at the end when the install is done
> /opt/vmware/bin/vmware-config.pl
>
> Note that vmware-player and vmware-workstation are mutually exclusive

Thanks.

It seems to me that VMware PLayer cannot do what I hoped to do. I want
to run Streetsmart Pro on my Gentoo machine, if possible. However
there isn't going to be a prebuilt copy of SSP ready to run in the
player. It appears that to even try it I'd have to run the
workstation.

Thanks to all for your help. It's an interesting topic to me.

Cheers,
Mark

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Re: [gentoo-amd64] VMware Player on Gentoo question

[Paul de Vrieze]

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On Thursday 09 March 2006 15:51, Mark Knecht wrote:
> On 3/9/06, Nuitari <nuitari@melchior.nuitari.net> wrote:
> > > You need to run a configure script. I don't know exactly where player
> > > stores it, but the ebuild should contain/output the information.
> >
> > They indicate it in the ebuild at the end when the install is done
> > /opt/vmware/bin/vmware-config.pl
> >
> > Note that vmware-player and vmware-workstation are mutually exclusive
>
> Thanks.
>
> It seems to me that VMware PLayer cannot do what I hoped to do. I want
> to run Streetsmart Pro on my Gentoo machine, if possible. However
> there isn't going to be a prebuilt copy of SSP ready to run in the
> player. It appears that to even try it I'd have to run the
> workstation.
>
> Thanks to all for your help. It's an interesting topic to me.

You can also use the server. It's not in the tree (bug #122500), and it's 
officially beta. It is however free as in beer and works properly. The only 
thing is that it's not really for graphics intensive work as it is network 
based.

Paul

-- 
Paul de Vrieze
Gentoo Developer
Mail: pauldv@gentoo.org
Homepage: http://www.devrieze.net

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